Warum die meisten Menschen nie reich werden, Teil 2

0:00Now I'm excited, dude. Now I'm coming as a student, and I'm I'm pumped. All right, dude. Okay, my one question, and by the way, all these questions I'll be asking you are going to be for the audience, so people can know, but mostly kind of for me. I'm I want to learn from you. >> Yeah. >> What do you think is the number one thing of people's shortcomings when it comes to building their business? Like you've noticed a pattern with men. You're like, this this is like a reoccurring thing. What would you feel is the most common thing that hinders a man's growth in his business?

0:29>> Uh Well, if you think about it just from a like what they're not doing versus what they're doing perspective, which I think is the easiest way to think about it, um it starts with them not doing anything. So, there's probably a number of reasons they're not doing anything, but they're afraid, typically. They're afraid of looking stupid, like looking like a like a pick-me version for a guy of like I'm hustling now. Oh, you started a business. Um and their friends and family don't support it because by definition, if they haven't succeeded yet, they've never succeeded. And so, there's no reason for people to have tremendous confidence in the fact they're succeeding cuz everyone's told them business is hard, and so they're afraid of looking like a failure, and so for that reason they continue to delay.

1:08Um and they stay in this period of wanting to be a business owner, wanting to start a business, and never actually starting a business. Um for the people who have begun trying to do business, um they'd understand they don't understand the how business works, but at the most basic level, you let someone know about the stuff that you do to help them, and that's either delivered to a product or a service of some kind, and then you get them to give you money to do it. It's really not that difficult.

1:36And so, if you can invite people to a party, you can let people know about your stuff, and if they respond back that they are interested, and then you get them to give you money, you own a business. It's not that hard. Um but because of the fear of rejection from the people that they would reach out to, and because of fear of judgment from the people that they do know, so fear of rejection from strangers, fear of judgment from people they know, they choose to do neither. And so, most people will spend more time working on their business in their mind than in reality.

2:03And so, this is why I'm so grounded in like, this is like, just do this. Like, ignore the other stuff. Just let people know about your thing. And there's a lot of ways you can do that and I'll break that down. Um and then, if they have started to take some action, um typically, they're not consistent enough and their expectations on speed and volume are uh too short for speed and too little for volume. And so, they're like, well, I reached out to five people.

2:31And no one was interested. And I was like, okay. And I I I have a story of like, where I where this belief was broken for me, which was I uh I had started a business and I had a gym and I had a mentor at the time and he I wanted to get more customers and he said, "Hey, he was really successful." and he said, "I do flyers. That's how I get customers." And I was like, "Okay, I'll do flyers." And uh I I ran a campaign. I put um uh I think 300 flyers out on cars.

2:58And uh I waited and then the phone rang and one guy called and said, "Hey, I think you dinged my Mercedes." when I I was like, and I hung up the phone. >> [laughter] >> And that was that was the only call that I got from those flyers. And so, then I saw him a week later or called him a week later and we talked. And uh he was like, "Oh, by the way, how did you know how the flyers go?" And I was like, "Oh, I'm going to tell him exactly how this went." Um and I was like, "Nothing, dude. They didn't work at all." And he was like, "Oh." He didn't even seem like he bothered by it. He was like, "Huh." He's like, "What was your test size?" And I was like, "Hm?"

3:30He was like, "Your test size." And I was like, "Oh, um I mean, I sent 300 out. Like, duh." And he was like, "Oh, yeah. He's like, hard to know anything after 300." He's like, "Typically, we'll keep doing test sizes of about 1,500 until we get something to work." He's like, "And then we do 3,000 a day every day." And it was a great understanding for me that I had done 300 in and he was doing 150,000 in a month.

3:56And so in a very real way, like people dramatically underestimate the amount of volume it takes. And it happens at all levels. Like I was talking to a friend of mine, very successful, very very successful. He's two billion dollar exits, very successful. And he was like, "I want to get into personal brand. I want to build a personal brand." And he's like, "Mine's not really growing the way yours is. Like what do I Like what am I doing wrong?" And so I You know, I pulled up his Instagram, pulled up mine, and I was like, "Well, you know, how many How many Instagram posts you making a day a week or sorry, a day?" He's like, "Oh, no, I'm doing one a day." I was like, "Okay, what about other platforms?" He was like, "No, I mean I'm I'm focused on Instagram." And I was like, "Okay."

4:32Um I posted at the time I was like, "I posted 450 times last week." And he's like, >> What? >> Yeah. Not on Instagram, but across all channels. >> Still, bro. >> We're over a thousand a week now. >> How many platforms? >> You know what we feel like when we threw out the 300 flyers? >> [laughter] >> Oh. >> Yeah. Okay, we're doing pretty well for our 300 flyers, dude. >> Across how many platforms? >> Yeah, a thousand a week is probably what we're at now.

4:57>> Dang, dude. >> Um and so they don't do enough. They think they're doing a lot. They They're me with 300 flies in their hands being like pounding their face being like, you know, "Why isn't this And then they're like, "You're the problem. You gave me bad advice." Right? Whoever they got it from and then they they cast stones at that person. Um or they're like, "It doesn't work. The universe is out to to get me." Um or they are doing the call it 100 posts a day. They're doing the right amount of volume, but they do it for a week.

5:26And then they're like, "Well, bro, I'm not I'm not George." >> Mhm. >> So what What the hell? I'm not I'm not famous yet. It's like, "Yeah, you've been doing it a week. How long you How long you've been making content?" >> 12 years. >> 12 years? It's like, "Dude, just keep it up 12 more years." >> Dude, it's funny you say that cuz 12 years and I felt like I my career started 3 years ago. >> Right. It takes a long time to learn.

5:51>> takes it majority of it was just the foundations. Like and then building up is important, but the foundations if it's weak, it's not going to be good. >> Mhm. >> I have this issue. I'm going to talk to you please. >> Oh, no, it's okay. So, you're saying um so you're say you're posting a lot, right? But what about quality versus quantity? Like where do you draw the line? How are you posting so much? >> I believe in qualium. >> Qualium? >> Yeah, quality volume. >> Okay.

6:17And what exactly are you posting of? Like what are like what are these hundreds of posts about? Same same thing? >> So, I think about content as manufacturing or capturing. It's either manufacture or capture. And so, if you're manufacturing like this is manufactured in that like we're, you know, we're flying in, we're going to put on a production, we're going to have sound, lights, all that stuff. We're making this. Capturing is like this is already occurring. We were just now capturing it and displaying it on a medium that allows more people to see it. And so, I would say 90% of that volume is capture, not manufacture. And so, from a time perspective, it's significantly more time on my team.

6:54It's no added time for me. And so, if I So, we have seminars we hold here for business owners um that lead into our consulting services at at our headquarters. And uh if I go downstairs and I do a Q&A, that's part of the delivery of that of that experience, right? Um and if I answer questions there, then they can take all of those clips and each one of those clips can be turned into like it's maybe there's one Q&A that's 10 minutes.

7:21It's like great, that's a mid on the highlight channel. And then that can be two or three shorts, and those two or three shorts can each be turned into multiple carousels, and the transcript of that can be turned into LinkedIns, and that can be turned into threads and tweets, and all of that, you know, a large percentage of that we've been able to automate with with the AI stuff that we do. Um but before that it was just people manually just [ __ ] hammering. Um but it's just how can I do what I already do and capture and repurpose that to a large degree. And so I'm a big believer in something I call the self-licking ice cream cone, but like how can you This is obviously from a pure business perspective, but like how can I engineer a business that in the delivery of my goods and services, I can create the advertising content or collateral that can then get me more customers? And so if you can create that loop, that it's like I get customers who get who get me content who then get me more customers who get me content and then it just goes and and it spins and spins and spins.

8:11>> ecosystem that lives on its own. >> 100% and then it's also Yeah, it's also way less dependent on the founder as well. >> Am am I too emotional when it comes to business because there's two things that I keep I I notice with myself. Um one is I I it sounds pompous, but it's I feel like people take my kindness for granted. And so like I I I I like to be the boss, but I also like to be the older brother, like to help and like coach in life. And I feel like I get taken advantage of when it comes in the business aspect of things. And then my other one is I keep I feel like I'm in a circle with trying to find the right teammates and I'm not finding the right teammates.

8:54Is this because of me or is it because my output like what what is it that would make a man not successful in this type of pattern? >> So say those are two different things right off the bat. >> off my emotions. >> Yeah. So you the original question you asked was am I too emotional? And I would say if it interferes with your goals in terms of how that emotion translates to behavior, then I'd say yeah. >> Let me give an example. There is two agents that are unbelievable. Like they represent the greatest in the field. Uh they were really really excited about me.

9:23>> Mhm. >> Um but I had 19 shows in America and they didn't show up to one of them. >> Right. >> So my brain was like, well, if they can't make time aside in the city that they live in, why would I feel like behind the scenes they would care about me? So, I chose not to be with them. >> This is so much fun. So, >> [laughter] >> if I >> at me and I knew I was going to get worked. >> I wish I brought a pencil.

9:47If if if if you knew if you found out that they were working around the clock trying to get you deals while you were in town and it was a massive deal. >> Yeah. >> Would you be okay with them missing your thing? >> If they were working for me behind the scenes? >> Yeah, they're like working >> why they didn't show up? Yes. >> Okay. They don't show up either way.

10:12So, it changes nothing about reality. It's only the narrative that we attach to it. Now, I'll finish the thought which is just that I only care about the output. And so, if the agent is good then they will bear fruit. >> Yeah. >> Whether he's able to do it with one phone call and he's on a vacation the other 364 days a year or not, would I rather have somebody who has good intentions who ends up destroying me or somebody who has bad intentions and ends up making me? Who should I rather have?

10:44I'd rather have someone who has bad intentions and it ends up making me. Right? >> I think I'm I'm I'm I think I am immature in that sense. I think I take things so personally because I don't know how to separate my brand and me. >> I think you care about intention. >> Yeah. >> I care zero about intention. Like I'll I'll give you a story that might make this real. So, friend of mine um in the fitness space uh was in a competition judge wasn't counting his reps. Told the judge he was going to kill him in the moment. Obviously, he wasn't. He was like, "I'm going to [ __ ] kill you."

11:17>> [laughter] >> So, he was like, "Count my reps, right?" And he ended up getting like you know, it became the black sheep of the the the whole space. Him getting becoming the black sheep of the whole space and that judge acting the way they did ended up making his career. And gave him this giant overnight he got like 100,000 followers. He went from nothing to 100,000 and then he was able to start a business off that cuz he's actually a very good competitor. Um and so I say this because like I I used to spend a lot of cycles and this is not me in any way saying in any way self-aggrandizing. Just saying this is useful for me, use it if you want.

11:52>> Yeah, yeah. I never I never get offended by the way, bro. >> We don't know someone's intentions. >> What do you mean by that? >> We have no idea. No, no, no. I was like, "Dude, I will I will always answer that question." People think like like they throw it back and I'm like, "I will happily explain what I mean." >> No, no, I was I was just pretending I was offended. >> Yeah. So, we we never know why someone does what they do because they often don't know why what they do what they do. How many people go and take action all the time every day and you're like, "Why'd you do that?" And they're like, "Huh?" You're like, "You don't know."

12:19And so then we somehow try and guess why someone else did something and then make a judgment on our actions towards that person because of something that they don't even know about themselves. >> Mhm. >> I just care about what occurs as a result. So, if you work with this agent and fruit come from it, judge the fruit. If you work for 6 months and I haven't seen anything, I haven't seen anything. If the guy says, "Dude, I've been working around the clock." And you let's say you have evidence of him working around the clock, killing himself to try and get your deal gets you nothing. Do you still keep him?

12:48>> Bro, I have. >> Right. And so, it's just it makes it it makes it much easier. >> Dude, I you just ripped my heart out [laughter] of my stomach. I thought it would be a bad person if I didn't at least look at where their heart posture was pointed towards. >> That's a lot of words. Heart heart posture pointed towards. It's like, "What does that mean?" >> You know what I mean? Like think about it. Like I see like I'm going to use Logan not not using you as a real example. This is just like a fake example.

13:14>> If he's recording If he's recording me, >> how do his fruit taste? >> His I'm never using that ever >> [laughter] >> And by the way, you're going to have a bone to pick with Jesus. Oh, you don't like my terms, Don't believe in me, don't believe in my [laughter] words. Uh I think what my problem is is you're right, dude. I care too much about the like in my brain if he was holding the camera and he wasn't doing a good job, but I saw him sweating and trying, in my brain I'll be like, "It's okay, he's trying. His heart is at least there."

13:44But I will also measure the guy who's not here, his heart's not here, but his work is there. I get rid of that guy and I keep this guy. So, I'm in a really bad place. >> And then you add up all the outputs and you get what you have. >> This is why I'm burnt out. >> Yeah. You have no hope. Cuz you're judging people on the wrong metric. To be fair, you're judging people on the on the wrong metric on the wrong metric for business. You have other metrics. You have conflicting priorities right now.

14:09And so I think that you need Do whatever you want. If I were in a similar position, um I would erase the word intention from my vocabulary within the context of business and think of things in terms of return on assets and resources. And so fundamentally, the best entrepreneurs in the world are the best allocators of resources. They have time, money, energy, effort, etc. Very limited. Compared to all the resources in the world, what we have access to is nothing. It's so small. And so how how good we are of stewards, to use a a biblical, you know, analogy, how good we are of stewards is how how much we can multiply with what we're given, right? And so if you continue to water trees that bear no fruit, you have a barren farm.

14:58And you're like, "But the tree is trying really hard to grow fruit." It's like, "You're still going to go hungry." >> Dude, that was deep. I needed to hear that, man. I I I didn't I don't know why I didn't expect you to go that direction. Like I I really didn't see it that like from that. >> Everyone is trainable, and this is my perspective on life, which is one of the I'll call it the difficulties of my world view, is that I genuinely believe anyone can learn to do anything. I do, however, also maintain the belief that it is not worth it for me to do that.

15:27So, I believe that somebody who's incredibly dumb can, with enough training and enough effort become a surgeon. I really believe that. However, I do not think it is worth my time to do that. And this is basic because in school, there are requisites, there are requirements. You have to pass the first grade to get to the second grade. Right? So, it's not that they're they're good or bad, whether they like is the teacher bad for failing a student?

15:56No. You don't meet the requirements. It would be unkind, not nice, it would be unkind to move them on because they're not ready. It doesn't put them in a in a in a position to succeed long-term. So, I think if you care like to to use words that you might enjoy better, if you truly care about the person, then you have to allow them the moment of momentary feedback from reality that they are not good enough because otherwise, you're saying that they're too weak. You're emasculating if it's a guy, emasculating the person. You're saying, "You're too weak to handle the truth."

16:26Cuz you're not that good. That said, here are the behaviors, here are the things that you could do to hold the camera better, and I'll show you how to do it. If the requirement of the job was that they already knew how to hold the camera, then either you hired someone who is inept or they lied on the way in. And if and oftentimes it's in the middle, which is that you didn't describe it with enough detail, and you made a guess, and maybe the guess was wrong. And then at that point, you have the decision whether do I do I want to train this person up or do I want to do I want to buy or build? Do I want to buy somebody else or do I want to build this person up? And it's purely a question of return on resources. And so, when hiring, we always want to hire for the the smallest skill deficiency. And so, oftentimes you probably heard like do is it attitude or aptitude, right? You hire for attitude, fire for aptitude. You know, I've Have you heard any of these statements?

17:10>> I'm shaking my head yes. >> Okay. So, if you hire for attitude, it's like hiring for character traits and like I hire for their heart, right? Big amorphous words, >> Yeah. rather than aptitude, their skills, what they're good at, right? Hire for attitude. I see all of this as skills, just like basketball. And so, if I say, "Hey, I need you to be more charismatic." If I say that to somebody, let's say a salesperson that's working for me, "I need you to be more charismatic." He can't do anything with that. >> Yeah.

17:37>> Right. >> either got it or you don't. >> charis- What does charisma mean? I would have to say, "I need you to talk louder. And when you walk into a room, I need you to see everyone and say their names, and I want you to walk up to everyone, shake their hands, look at them in the eyes, and repeat the last few words they said to you back to them before stating your next sentence." Okay? And when they're talking, I need you to nod your head. And uh and when uh nod their head when you're when you're talking, right? So, there's a list of behaviors that I might say, and then be like, "Do that." And then all of a sudden, people might describe the guy as warm and charismatic.

18:09And so, by by saying that, then I'm making the point that the character traits that we seek out are really just behavior sets. Now, if someone just comes in with let's just just say an amalgamation, a big bucket of skills. They have a bucket like skill number one, shake hands. Skill number two, say hello. Being real, like breaking it down to the most basic level. This is gigantic bucket of skills that they've learned. We want to hire the person who has the smallest net skill deficiency. So, if I'm looking for an AI researcher, I might be willing to deal with somebody who doesn't have as much charisma.

18:40And be willing to train the small amount of charisma because the amount it would take me to train >> Mhm. >> the AI researcher skill or whatever, would be significantly more than the effort and resource it would take me to train the charisma and the interpersonal stuff. If I'm hiring a cashierist at a frozen yogurt shop, teaching someone to use the cash register might take 5 minutes. And teaching someone to mop the floor, maybe another five. And so, I could probably train that entire person in an hour or two. And so, it makes much more sense for me to hire for the character traits, the bucket of skills around social dynamics and social behavior, than it does for me to hire out oh, past experience working a cash register.

19:15And so, fundamentally when we're hiring, we want to hire for the smallest skill deficiency so that they have the highest likelihood of being able to succeed with the job and uses up the smallest amount of resources from the business in order to get them to the level they need to to succeed. >> Hey, what's up, guys? I wanted to give you guys the good news that the heartofdavid.co is now out and available. I know a lot of you guys have been hitting me up being like, "Bro, when is it coming out?" I'm sorry it took so long. I just wanted to make sure that what I drop is very special for you guys. So, check [music] it out. Hit the link in my description or go to the heartofdavid.co and uh enjoy your merch today. Did you learn this through like going through it or did you read books and study this or like how did you go how did you manage to to be so equipped at that?

19:58>> I I I think it's um thank you first off, but um I think it's in an effort to define the world around me in terms I could observe. Like I hear these things like be do have and I was like, "Huh, is that true?" And so, the three the three questions I've I've two things written on my wall permanently inside of my office. One is my good day formula, which is uh work out with friends, eat with friends, write something. When I do those things, I have a good day.

20:25Um and today I've done two of them. So, I'm thrilled. And I all I have to do is write something down and I'm good to go. >> [laughter] >> On the other the other little threesome that I have, calm down, world. >> So many clips. >> is is is three questions, which is uh logic, what does that mean? Evidence, how do you know that? And utility, why does that matter? And so, when people present with things or like be do have, I'm like, "Well, what does that mean?"

20:54And then someone has a response, "How do you know that?" And then if they finally answer and they have some evidence for why they know that, I'm like, "Okay. And why why does that matter?" And so, this allows you to sift through a lot of the noise of the world to try and get to the bare truth. And for me, the truth is the things that I can observe because it's the only world that I happen to live in. And so, I just try to describe the world in that way. And when I see these isms like hire for aptitude not attitude, I was like, "Okay, I'm sure there's some truth to this, but let me dig into it."

21:22And it turns out for me, there isn't. It's just that in some situations, in many, especially for a small business that has a low-skilled job, which are the majority of jobs, uh it makes more sense to hire for somebody who already has these skills. We just don't call them skills, we call them traits. But if you teach a child to behave a certain way, it's a skill. And if they can learn it, you can teach it. It's just a question of whether it's worth the business's resources.

21:47Which is again why we have requirements on all job postings, which is you must have 4 years of Excel, blah blah blah blah blah blah because we expect that I don't have to teach you to read. I can. It's not worth it. >> Do you hand train or did you train somebody to train? >> Uh do I train? I train publicly via my content. >> I know that. >> [laughter] >> I know this. I I'd love to get into that, but I'm talking about like here.

22:12Like since you're doing the training for other companies, do you also train inside your house or did you train somebody to be like you and train all these other people? >> Yeah, training the trainer is is for sure a role of delegation. Because the the skill of teaching is another skill. >> Yeah. I'd like to get into school. >> Yeah. >> When did you come up with that concept and how's it going? >> So, I didn't come up with it. Um Sam is the is the the primary founder, if you will. Um Daniel and I have the title of co-founder. Daniel's the CTO.

22:45Um and I have no official role, but I I would call myself chief promoter. Um but uh the idea was I think pretty simple. Um there's a couple things. Well, number one is that um we believe that humans will want more community not less in the future. So, that's one assumption and that has continued to be more and more true. Uh number two is that the world of education specifically, but media in general is there's a there's a trust crisis. Nobody knows who to trust. Um And so, if we could create a platform that allowed people to teach the things they love with other people who like that stuff, we would one make the world a better place, but two over time if we have enough of those people, we could become a trusted source for education.

23:31Which is how do I know this guy is actually going to teach me really well? Well, if I can look at his reviews and there's hundreds of other people who have learned from this person, then it's a high likelihood. Like imagine an Amazon that had no reviews. Imagine how blind you would feel trying to buy stuff. That is how most of the world right now tries to buy education that is not called the formal education path um beyond called the free stuff that you can get online for YouTube and whatever. Um and so, we thought that if we brought community to more people and we were able to uh take a fragmented internet and put these little ponds together where people can find people like them and do things that they're passionate about, that we would make the world a better place and people would be able to earn an income teaching things they love to people who also love it, too.

24:14>> Um do you have your program in school or do you have an outside entity? Like when you do your coaching? Cuz I saw this board. >> Oh, yeah. So, that's a scaling road map. Um so, I would say we I wouldn't describe what we do as coaching. Um most of it is bad branding for the word. Um but in general, >> a coach now. >> Yeah, totally. How do you feel about that? >> That everyone's a coach or about >> like you inspired and people like you have inspired so many people to do this, but there's a lot of uh uh really bad teachers out there and I Does that make it exciting for you cuz you're like, yes, less competition?

24:49>> No. No, I I certainly I certainly do not think that way. Um I think that people attribute far more to malice than to incompetence. Which is that like they let's say you have a bad first grade math teacher. You're not like this person is evil. It's they're just not that good at teaching. And how do you get good at teaching? You practice teaching. And unfortunately, some people get practiced on and they're not that good. >> [laughter] >> Right? Um And so also there's an unfortunate bias for students for some reason in the alternative world of education. If you're trying to learn how to pickle fruit versus trying to learn algebra, that when you learn arithmetic from your first math teacher once you learn algebra, people aren't like screw my arithmetic teacher, algebra is really where the the real stuff happens. When people move to 101 to 201, all of a sudden they forsake their first teacher, which I find interesting. I don't know what it is, but I've just noticed that as a trend. Um But in terms of why why are there people? I One, there's for sure an underbelly to anything. Like there are people who try to make a quick buck. And I would say by and large if all of my content in aggregate could be taken as like it is not quick and it is not pain-free.

25:53It is risky, it is painful, but it will take longer than you thought and it will suck. >> [laughter] >> Um But um my my my mental lesson for all of this stuff has always just been proof first. Like the proof is the pudding. Right? It's not even in the pudding, it is the pudding. Like if you are the number one uh skateboarder in the world plenty of people would love to learn how to do an ollie from you. And so start with the proof and then everything else comes. >> Yeah. >> And so the reason that I think my brand grew disproportionately from other people who could argue arguably talk about business um is that I had proof first. Right? So like we had a you know, $46 million exit. Um And we had a relatively large relatively not Apple, but like relatively large business compared to by percentage uh than most people. And so that gave us

26:36>> by the way. >> enough They gave us enough um credibility to say like listen, I I can't get you to a billion cuz I haven't been there yet. Um but I know how to get to a hundred. I've done it three times. So I'm like pretty confident. Um And so I can just that's where my that's where my competence ends for now. And I feel like we're on the path to getting to a billion and beyond. Um But yeah, I just talk about what I know. >> Do you feel like people should start with their physique first and then their business? Or do you think like when you see people that are kind of out of shape?

27:07I know there's a lot of people that feel that they can't even run a good business if they're not in like a good shape. >> I mean, I don't think that's true. I mean, I'd love it if everyone got in shape, but I know plenty of like super out of shape rich people. >> Mhm. >> Yeah, I I I don't think a lot of people sacrifice one thing to get to the other. Um I think you can have a live a live a life of and um not or. Uh I think I was fortunate that I got into fitness really, really young. I've been training like 21, 22 years now. Um and so for me to make maintaining muscle is actually significantly easier than gaining muscle. And so I gained it when I had the time to gain it and now it's very easy for me to maintain it. Um but it's kind of like building a business. It's much harder to build a business than it is to maintain a business.

27:46And so when you're in that kind of period, I I think that there are seasons of life um where you will be unbalanced for periods of time and it's just because you have limited resources in terms of time, money, effort, etc. And so you need to allocate it where you think you're going to get the highest return relative to where you want to go. If you're like, I want to be the absolute richest man in the world, um there are going to be some choices and some tradeoffs that you're willing to make or you're going to probably have to make. And I think a lot of the the the anger that people have in the world is that they see the price tag for the things they want, they're not willing to pay it.

28:17>> Yeah. >> It's true. >> Yeah. I've never I've never myself, everybody's different, I've never really seen money as my motive. I've always seen my purpose and then money will follow. And how I kind of view it is like I will bless me with it when I when I'm ready for it. And then he'll give me wisdom to make money. Like I remember there was a year um where I just turned to my mom and I said I'm I'm I'm going to make millions next year. And I I I haven't made my first million yet. And I don't know I I looked at it and said, "I don't know how I'm going to do it, but I really feel like the Lord says I could do it if I believe in him and if I trust in him." It was the first one that I made a few million that year. And I just remember looking at myself in the mirror and be like, "Whoa, like it first came with belief and like I could really do this."

29:07And so, I think what I'm struggling with now is the maintaining because I feel like I'm getting fatigued and I I feel like I'm getting burned out and sometimes I I said this to my sister cuz she she got inspired by working with me and she she's going to go chase her dreams. And I told her I said, "Enjoy chasing it because holding on to it it's it's way worse than like >> Defending the belt is much harder. >> Yeah. So, my What would you say your advice to me is for that? Right now I'm trying to defend

29:36>> Yeah. >> what I have, but at the same time I want that, you know, that wheel, right? I started doing stand-up comedy, started doing stage work, went on tour. >> Yeah. Do you like it? >> Bro, like if I could just only do that, done. >> I hate this conversation. >> [laughter] >> He's like, "This?" >> This is pulling teeth, though. Now, this I I honestly, bro, like I'm I'm I'm an extremely, extremely blessed man. There are people that work way harder than me, way more talented than me, but I I was given this and I definitely appreciate it. And I do appreciate your time. Uh I just feel like I go back and forth so much, I get so dizzy. But I'm trying to create that ecosystem cuz I know that the pod could turn into ticket sales and then they this kid produce stand-up clips and then now I went on a 19- This is how I know I'm bad at business. This is true. I'm not lying. I'm terrible at business. I'm not good.

30:25>> [laughter] >> Uh I went on a 19-city tour and praise God it did well, but every person in the meet and greet goes, "I had no idea you do comedy." They called into the theaters. They're like, "What is he doing?" Bro, how How I do that? Like how did I not How did I how did I get to a place >> How would they find out about it? >> I thought I was >> Well no, it's like >> out with comedy and >> Cuz the tour was a podcast tour and so it was half podcast and but he opened up with comedy. And so when he did his comedy people were like oh dude, I don't even know you do stand up. But they knew it was going to be a show.

30:58>> Yeah, but I feel like if he would have done that, his audience would have known what he was doing. He would have put on a like a pretty good awareness campaign. >> of it, yeah. >> He would have posted 400 times that week telling people >> I would. >> How do you know when it's the right time to build the ecosystem where you could go from one successful thing you've built to something else where they could feed each other. And how do you know that you're not being greedy and over spread yourself? >> Yeah, I wouldn't I mean It's interesting you use the the label greedy. Um I would just use it I would just say unfocused. Um which I think you asked the original question of like where do people fall like where do people fail when they're trying to start a business? First is they don't start, second they think it's going to happen faster they're going to have to do way less than it takes.

31:39The next one after that is that they're unfocused. Is that they shiny object, right? There's too many opportunities. But the thing is is that you have such limited resources as a business owner, especially a small business owner, that like you you really can't do much. It's actually astonishingly how little how how little we can do compared to how much there can be done, right? It's almost it's nothing. >> Could you elaborate this offer me? >> So if you look at how the vast majority of people made their wealth, the vast majority, they made their wealth doing one thing very well and then then they have enough resources that they can start building out other verticals. And so we only see the ultra success once it's already built through one channel and then it appears like an ecosystem.

32:18But almost no businesses begin this one. >> So they begin with multiple things? >> No, they begin with one thing and they go all in on that thing for an extended period of time. And they allow that one thing to just they want to take it to the natural extreme. I'll give you I'll give you a story to to illustrate the point. So a friend of mine, acquaintance, uh from high school called me up. >> He's not friends with him anymore. >> [laughter] >> No, it wouldn't be fair to him. It wouldn't be fair to my friends to call him a friend. friend. Um an acquaintance of mine from high school saw me doing some stuff and he stole my cell phone number and and hit me up from like however long ago. Anyways, and uh he had a has a had a contracting roofing business.

32:52And so I said, you know, how's business? And he's like, "Ah, it's it's great." Um and he's describing that they how they do roofs. And I was like, "Oh, that's amazing, dude." And uh he was like, and he paused. He's like, "We also do a little general contracting work." And I was like, "Okay." He's probably doing five or six million bucks here. I was like, "Okay. Got it. So you do roofs and you do some general contracting." He was like, "Yeah, and we do some building flips." And I was like, "Okay."

33:18He's like, you know, I I don't I don't leave money on the table. And so I use this almost like everyone on my team knows this joke. I'm like, "Ah, I wouldn't want to leave money on the table uh because there you leave small money on the table by continuing to go all in on the one thing. And that's how you make the most money. And so if you look at the biggest roofing company in the United States, it's a billion-dollar-plus company. So why does this person think that he needs to have three businesses in order to have a larger business?

33:48It doesn't. It's just typically they're they're limited in some way by their ability to get customers. And so the only thing they can think of is sell them more stuff. But in so doing create multiple businesses that are too operationally complex to manage. And so you never really overextend. You just under talent. So you don't have enough good people who can do the stuff. And usually you can't get enough good people because the core business doesn't make enough money to attract the good people. And so then you get into this no-man's-land where you have three uh we call them mutant businesses where it's like, "Well, this one kind of feeds this one and this one kind of feeds this one." And it only works in the entrepreneur's head but never in reality. And so I define commitment as the elimination of alternatives. And so focus, if you think about it, I think focus and commitment are very similar, because if you think of the absolute most focused person in the world, they would do not they wouldn't sleep, they wouldn't eat, they would only do one thing. And anything that is not that one thing is less focused than absolute focus. And [snorts] so, the most focused entrepreneurs say no to things that they desperately want to do and know they could crush.

34:49But they say no to that because they realize that saying no is actually saying yes again to the thing that they believed and they started on their their mission to do. And so, um I would say it is probably one of five or six big consistent errors that entrepreneurs will make. It's very difficult to get out of when you have multiple half children. They're not They're not to adult They're not to adolescents yet. They're not They're not adults yet. They're just toddlers. And then you just don't have enough time or resources to feed them all and you don't have you don't have the money for a nanny.

35:20And so, but like they don't actually grow up though. >> [laughter] >> And so, and then to where the analogy ends, obviously, is that sometimes you have to let it go. And to use a different analogy that would be more palatable, you have to prune the tree in order to keep it growing. And so, a lot of times you have to redirect Yeah, you have to redirect the resources towards the thing that you get the highest returns on. >> So, when do you So, it's when it lucratively not Is that right? When you produced enough money for you to flow another idea is when you're able to do that?

35:53>> You can always do it. The question is whether the returns are higher than doing more on the same one that you're already have have leverage in. And so, typically, when you have this cash that's coming from this thing that's working, that cash would probably be best suited going back into that thing that's working, making it even more profitable. It's like you want to feed the feed the winners, starve the losers. You don't want to steal from the winner and then feed the loser. >> Yeah. >> Now, we don't know it's a loser yet, but it's very rare, not impossible, but very rare that someone will gain more from splitting their attention.

36:26And so, a different way of thinking about this is imagine you did 3 years in one business, and then you had the idea of another business. We usually will say, "Okay, well, man, I could probably in the first year of that business do half of what I'm doing in this business, so probably by the second year I could do as much or more than I'm currently doing." You're like, "Oh, that's a better business than the one I'm in." But, we can't compare it like that because you're already in year three of your current one. >> Yeah. >> Which means that you'd actually have to compare it to year five of your current one with all that attention and resources directed back at that one.

36:57And most times your five will almost always be your one or your two of any new business. And so, this is why even if you are in an inferior vehicle, um I think there's a saying in the stock market, which is uh time in the market beats timing the market. >> Time in the market beats >> timing the market. >> Yeah. >> So, it's like you have to put your time in the in the lifting world, which I come from, is like we call it time under the bar. It's like you just have to put enough time under the bar at

37:23>> And this is purely like business, right? It's not even like you wouldn't put this in the category of I have a successful business, and then this is my passion. And I I want I do it because I love it. >> I think you can do something because you love it. I think that's fine. It's just a question of like you have limited resources. Is again, I speak in purely practical terms. >> Yeah, business. >> When you when you when you when you divert resources, you divert nutrients, sunlight, water to another plant, the main plant will grow less than if you put all of that on the main one.

37:52That's also fine. It's just understand the trade that you're making. Is that this will not grow as fast, and you might be less profitable overall, and probably more stressed. >> What was the first time you've ever done that for yourself? >> I've done that so many times, which is why I can describe it in such vivid clarity. >> So, [laughter] so Do you Do you still do that now? Is there >> Yes, it's still incredibly difficult. I I mean, one of the one of the the uh recurring themes in my content I call the woman in the red dress.

38:21And it's because it's probably one of my favorite scenes in the Matrix, which is uh uh Neo is going through the training program. He's walking behind Neo Morpheus uh and Morpheus is talking about something. There are all these people. All of a sudden then the woman in the red dress walks by and Morpheus says, "Were you listening to me or were you looking at the woman in the red dress?" And he says, "Look again." He looks back and it's an agent pointing a gun at his head. And to me, the woman in the red dress is always the distraction, the thing that looks appealing. Right? The thing that will take you take your eye off the ball.

38:47Um and so, when I met Leila, for example, I was a successful entrepreneur. I'll use quotes. I thought I was successful. Um I had I think I had four or five gyms at the time when we met. >> Um some guy who owns one is like, >> [laughter] >> And and I I had a I had a a dental agency that I had a partner with. I had a chiropractor agency that I had a partner with. I had a gym launch business where I'd fly around and launch gyms, not where my gyms were.

39:18And I had all of that and I was the CEO of all of it. So, I'd be like, "I own companies." Um and obviously when we started dating, uh she had this brilliant idea where she said, "Hey, you know, this launch business, you take all the cash from this and you feed all these other ones. What if you just spent all your time on the launch business cuz you're spending like 20% of your time on it and it's making like all the money?"

39:42And the the the difficulty between there and where I ultimately ended up was like three hard conversations that I had to have that I was dreading. And so, when I had to really write down, "Will these three conversations be the things that limit me from my goal?" It became much more practical of like, "Okay, I'm going to get through these things. I will feel like I'm going to die, but I won't. And I will get [snorts] through it." And then I did. I did all three in the same day.

40:08Cuz I was just like I had I had to like rip it off like a band-aid. >> How did I feel? >> Free. >> Did it feel way less worse than you thought it was? >> The anticipation is always worse. >> Mhm. >> And then after the first one's done, you're like, "I want to call everyone." Like >> [laughter] >> I like tell tell your you're like >> Yeah, yeah. >> Is Dad home? >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got some things I got to share. >> I got to talk to him. Put on speaker. >> Yeah. And so and so yeah, I think it's it's it's a great momentum builder is like just have one car hard conversation you realize that you don't die and you'll and you'll get through it. But um you have like it has been there has been no truer lesson in my life than the return on focus. I think David Senra from the Founder podcast, I don't know if you if you've heard of it. Um he said he if he consolidated it every single podcast he's done with all the billionaires he's been on into one word, it was focus.

40:56Which is just choosing to go all in over and over and over again on this one thing. >> Is there something that and this is purely we're not talking practical. We're talking just like you as your personality. Is there one thing that right now when you look back on that you truly love and that you wish you could be doing right now? Not because you would give all this away, but just something that you love. >> Um yeah, there's tons of things that I love. Um but this is a really good question cuz it'll lead into something kind of cool. So downstairs I have I think the sickest gym in Vegas.

41:27Um and it has only a membership of of one. >> It's only for you? >> Well, the team can use it obviously. But like yeah, there's no real membership. But this is really really interesting. So we talk about passions, right? And we hear the term follow your passion. And I actually took that very much to heart. And so when I was right out of college, I was management consultant. I did space harbor intelligence stuff um as a defense contractor right out. And I was very miserable during that period of time. And I was very obsessed with fitness cuz I'd always been into fitness probably like 7 years into fitness at that point. I was like really into I was competing, things like that.

42:04And the people I worked with were like, "Dude, you got to do fitness, man. Like it's literally all you talk about. You're obsessed with it." And I even got to the point where one of my co-workers was like, "I'll give you the money to start the gym if you if you just start one." >> [laughter] >> And so that was kind of my sign. And so, um I ended up obviously leaving and then fast forward, I I started a gym. And the gym ended up becoming successful. But what was interesting is that I started the gym because I loved fitness.

42:31But actually owning a gym had very little to do with fitness. I had to sell memberships, I had to fix broken equipment, I had to fix playlists, I had to pay payroll, I had taxes, I had admin, I had I had to make the workout, all of these things. And the majority of my day actually had nothing to do with what I was quote passionate about. And the majority of the customers that I had weren't actually interested in powerlifting and strength training. They were like women who wanted to lose weight. Um but I was like, "Okay, well that's the market. I'll just keep growing growing the business." And then I eventually, you know, had those and then I started gym launch, we licensed the model of 6,000 locations, we ended up selling to private equity.

43:03And today I have a gym with no members. And I only say that because there's this idea of following your passion. And it's a very attractive thought. It's a great sound bite when someone asks you, you know, what what piece of advice would you give to people? You'd be like, "Follow your passion." The thing is is it's not actually practically relevant relevant because one, your passions will likely change. The things that I loved when I was 20, I might not love now.

43:30>> Yeah. >> Uh number two, um even if they don't change, the percentage of your day that will actually be doing your passion is typically very small if you want to make money doing your passion. You'll never work another day in your life. Sure. >> [laughter] >> Right. Um and number three, money also tends to change your relationship with it. I had a different mentor who said never try to turn your passion into a business because uh then you turn it into work.

43:55>> Mhm. Mhm. >> And so different different wisdoms, but I'll say as somebody who um actually went full cycle on this and I don't know many people who have who actually said like, "I followed my passion. I did the full thing." And I've ended back where I started, which I now have a gym, and I work out with the people that I like, and that's it. And there's no memberships, there's no marketing, that's that's what it is, and I love it. >> Yeah, that's good.

44:17>> And so, I think that in some ways you can pervert your passion in a way by trying to monetize it. >> Mhm. >> I'm not saying that you can't. That's I can't and shoulds, do whatever you want. >> Yeah. >> Um >> I love that [ __ ] >> But >> that says >> [laughter] >> But but my experience has been that like if you want to do your passion, do the thing you're passionate about, and then make money where the market would like to pay you for your goods and service.

44:44>> I agree. I was on I I I Well, if you heard me in the beginning, I said I never chase the money. That's why when podcasting is very lucrative, the stand-up thing is very lucrative to me, bro, it was a crazy surprise, but I truly went into this as if I if I could put a sandwich in front of my face, like and I could eat it off the money that I make off of what I'm doing, I'll be so happy. And so, I went that direction. I mean I could tell why there's a lot of hiccups, and I feel like after talking to you, I've been dealing with problems for like like 8 months, and I'm going to laugh when I say this, but like I feel [snorts] like you would have taken maybe half an afternoon to solve all this stuff. Like how like for when he said it's hard conversations, my gut started hurting. Like I had like an ulcer. I was like, "Oh, dude, I don't want to have those conversations." And I also have a problem with uh and this might be something I I shouldn't do, but every time I get something, I like to divide it with people that I love. So, I'll hire friends and family, and that just never works out.

45:42>> I don't think there's anything wrong with hiring friends and family if you hold them to the same standard as you'd hire anyone else. >> Yeah. >> And you make that clear. >> Isn't that right, Mel? >> Oh, [laughter] yeah. >> I think if you if you just make that you make that clear up front, I think it's totally fine. >> Yeah. Yeah. Um I read online, you know, people hear you talking about persuasion a a right? You think it's something very important. So, where do you draw the line when you're coaching people or with yourself between persuasion and manipulation? >> Woah. >> Woah.

46:09>> Woah, dude. >> So, then I would just ask you what's the difference? >> Woah. >> What do I think is the difference? >> This is I'm glad I'm in the middle of this, dude. >> So, if it were I don't know. >> No, I just want to hear your definition. >> Yeah, yeah, okay. So, I think persuasion is I'm going to make something sound nice and I'm going to explain why I think it I like it. I'm going to make it attractive, right? I think I'm going to persuade you to liking something, so I'm going to make that thing attractive in the way that I would be attracted to it, right? And then I think manipulation is maybe using things against you, figuring out what you might choose, maybe playing on your feelings, knowing that maybe you have a hard time with something, so I'm going to use that to to to tug at your heartstrings in order to get you to do what I want you to do.

46:49>> So, in both situations you can go ahead. >> Yeah, can I say one thing? Isn't manipulation also changing something to look like something else? >> Yeah, yeah. >> So, this is why it's important to ask for definitions because we like if we manipulate the way that you described it's more deceiving, right? Do I say something that is not true? Um versus saying things to change someone's behavior. So, if you think about manipulation is like I'm going to do something or say something that changes someone's behavior. If those statements are true, is that persuasion? Is that manipulation? Is that help?

47:24What's the difference? >> Hm. If you do Say it again. >> If I do or say something that is truthful and it changes your behavior, >> Yeah. That's not manipulation. >> Okay. >> That's persuasion. >> Okay. >> But is that even persuasion if you what he's telling me is the truth? >> Well, yeah, it's persuasion. >> 100%. >> If it's if it's true. >> State the facts and tell the truth. Oh, totally. That's the rule number one in marketing for us. >> Okay. >> State the facts and tell the truth. >> Yeah.

47:49>> And if the truth isn't compelling, make the truth compelling as in change reality. >> That's manipulation. >> To change reality? >> Isn't that >> No, I'm saying like if I want to say like I am Let's say I wanted to say I'm the greatest marketer of all time. Well, then I would want to say Well, I'm not going to say I'm the greatest marketer of all time. I haven't met all the marketers, right? But I could say I did this launch. We did $106 million in a weekend. All using the stuff that I showed my books that I give away for free.

48:16And I use the stuff in the books on the book to market the book. >> Mhm. >> That would be proof. >> Yeah. >> And so if I state that, is there any deception there? >> Mhm. >> Does it make you more likely to purchase something around marketing from me? >> Yeah. >> Probably. >> I'm actually putting in my description. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> Links in the description. >> So, state the facts, tell the truth. And so, anyways, I I I asked you the question because um I would say that most people, not most people, some people might define the difference between help and manipulation

48:45>> Mhm. >> as intent. And as somebody who doesn't really put a lot of weight on intention, because you can intend for a good thing to happen, a bad thing happens. You can intend for a bad thing to happen, a good thing happens. And so, I care very little about it. I care much more about like are there skills that you can acquire to increase the likelihood that people take a specific action? And the answer is yes. And so, those things are going to be in the short term changing the relative value of a reinforcer, of something good. So, how can I make the bad thing appear better, which typically just means you just talk about the bad thing, which for most people is like, "Oh god, I forgot about that." You You bring it back up.

49:22If you don't do this thing, you don't lose weight, you could eventually live shorter life. State the facts and tell the truth. People over 50 lbs overweight, they lose 5 years on your life, which means you might not be able to see your great-grandkids and you'll just see your grandkids. If that's meaningful to you, you might be more likely to take an action as a result of me stating that fact. >> Mhm. >> And so, it's really just aligning facts that would naturally in the short term increase someone's motivation to take an action. >> Okay. I like

49:48>> That was a fun conversation. >> Makes >> I like that a lot. >> Yeah. But if the person's action ends up hurting them, >> Right. >> was it manipulation? >> Yeah. >> If I didn't mean to hurt them, was it manipulation? >> No. >> But the same thing happened. >> make it you don't know. >> Right. And so this is why for me a lot of a lot of words the end result of many words means the same thing. Cuz like teaching is fundamentally changing someone's behavior.

50:16So is selling. So is persuasion. So is manipulation. >> Yeah. >> Like all of these things are just like we do a thing or say a thing to get someone to do something. Which also is what the point of communication is. >> Yeah. >> The only reason we communicate is to change people's behavior. >> Yeah. >> It's why we communicate. >> So it's >> hi so you say hi back. I change your behavior. If I don't say hi, you don't say hi. >> So in personal relationships, how do you navigate that when somebody tells me, "Well, my my intention wasn't that." You know how that happens a lot? It's like, "Well, this wasn't You might get I I do something to you and you get upset at me and I'm like, "That wasn't my intention." How do you navigate personal relationships in that type of

50:50>> So for the people who are closest to me, they play by the same rules as me. Which is like for Leila and I, we care very little about intention. Now, I have to say that we've grown a a very large affinity for one another because we both help each other become who we want to become. I'll use loose words there. Um and do we will want to do. And so we both increase the odds of us getting the life we want by being with each other. And so we just talk in those terms, which may seem robotic, but it's more just clear communication.

51:17>> Yeah. >> And also I know it sounds odd. And I know people even hearing me talk this way sounds odd. But it like the alternative is is mediocre average normal boring. And like those are none of the things that I that I want in my life. So like it makes sense that I would communicate differently um than most people because I don't want the same things as other as other people. >> Yeah. >> But making the world this way has allowed me to predict behavior significantly better.

51:43And I'll give you a story that that um that kind of might drive this point home. So, back in the day, um, I was a a little bit more boisterous of a kid. Uh, rambunctious, you know, teenager. And I, um, was on the tennis team at my high school. And I ended up they had if you were a senior, if you had like private lessons, you could you could leave instead of doing practice, you could just go to a private lesson then you go to the matches, right?

52:11And so, um, I ended up uh, having a a coach for a short period and then we ended up not having the coach anymore, but I ended up still being able to not go to practice. And so, I would just go to the weight room and work out because I liked lifting cuz that was what I was like really into. And so, I told my mother this, um, and so she, um, being a Christian, uh, not to be fair had nothing to do with her being a Christian.

52:37>> [laughter] >> You're just saying that now because now I can be like, "That's why you left." >> No, not at all. Not at all. Um, no. Uh, she called the school to turn me in for an honor violation. Uh, without talking to me. It was my junior year. >> Rat on you. >> Yeah, she broke the 11th commandment. Yeah, without >> Rat on that rat on that. >> On that on that side, yeah. Um, >> [laughter] >> and so, what was interesting about that is that, um, she really had my best intentions at heart.

53:06>> Right. >> All she did was inflict damage. >> Mhm. >> And so, if I have someone in my life who all they want to do is see me succeed, but all they actually do is hurt me, I do not want them in my life. And so, some people feel guilt around that because they have established rules for themselves that make it impossible for them to cut people out of their lives. I don't have those rules.

53:31>> What's up, guys? This video is sponsored by Grand Canyon University. Guys, a lot of the conversations that we have on this podcast it has to do about faith, but a a of it also has to do about purpose. And those two come together in a really good way at Grand Canyon University because education should have a purpose and it should have a bright future. And that's why I'm excited that I'm sponsored by Grand Canyon University here in Phoenix, Arizona. That is a private, non-profit, Christian university that actually cares about your future. Grand Canyon University is grounded with Christian truth. They find it that their mission is to lead this generation to find their purpose and to lead with integrity.

54:09>> [music] >> And they actually make education accessible. The last 17 years they've kept the same rate for college tuition. They have over 380 programs. They have over 130,000 students. And then last year alone, I'm just talking 2025, they had $404 million for scholarship. So, [music] if you're looking for a community, a college, a university that not only will help you pave a beautiful future, but actually cares about your faith and your relationship with God, check out Grand Canyon University.

54:45Whether you want a degree on campus or online, find your purpose at GCU. Private, Christian, affordable, non-profit. GCU is purpose-driven education. Take action, find your purpose at GCU. If this excites you and you're actually interested, hit the link in my description or go to gcu.edu today. All right, let's get back to the show. Can I Can I bring up something? >> Yeah.

55:09>> That seems to me that she formed her own rules, lived by them, and it punished you by it. >> Maybe. >> So, that's why I always say like whose authority do you live by? >> Mhm. >> So, how do you know that your rules don't hurt others? >> Oh, they might. >> [laughter] >> I have no I have no knowledge. I mean, I have I have no ability. I have no [snorts] I mean like I have no ability to to know. >> Yeah.

55:33>> I do my very best. Um >> But I I I love that theory that you say because that it's so true. You know who stumbles upon this? Christians. They They like Do you know what I hear all the time? People like, "Yeah, you got to put the fear of God in them." And I'm like, "Hey, man, that comes naturally. You know what I mean? Like you don't got to do that." Uh and but I also want to let you know that the reason in the beginning of this podcast I said there is no condemnation through Christ Jesus because that's how he plays.

56:02The devil plays that way. The devil's the one that makes you feel kind of like, you know, you should do this or you shouldn't do that. Oh, how do you feel? You know I always tell people the devil will make you do a sin and then make you ponder how shitty you are for doing it. I've That is my best relationship with the devil. I'll be like, "No, I don't want to do it. I don't want to do it." He makes it really interesting, then I do it and he's like, "You silly dude. >> [laughter] >> You dumb." And now for 48 hours I'm just like, "Why did I do that, bro? Why did I do that?" Usually it's road rage. I'm coming out of trucks. [laughter] You know what I mean? Just got the Lord's word and then this guy cuts me off and now I want him to meet the Lord.

56:36Uh How do you deal with rage? >> Um man, I would say >> ever have it? >> Yeah, for sure. I would say that my core emotion is anger. >> [laughter] [screaming] >> It's like, "Oh, actually." >> [laughter] >> I've never seen somebody so casually >> That's my main emotion. >> Let's say I think my uh natural place is murder. I

57:03>> [laughter] >> I rest in in deep blood of my enemies. Bro, you said that >> [laughter] >> like a hit man, dude. Like a hit man. That was terrifying. And I And I want you to elaborate that. What do you mean? What do you What? What do you mean? Cuz you don't come off like that at all. You come off like >> monk. >> Yeah, man, you're so calm, cool, collected. >> Certainly not. Certainly not. Um >> We see him on the road. Oh, jeez Louise, that guy really is it.

57:30>> No, I um No, I mean I I have an ego. You know what I mean? And um um >> I don't want to say it. >> Yeah, you know, I know. Clearly. [laughter] We all know. >> I'm just kidding. I forgot that you live in anger, bro. Let me pull back my fangs. >> [laughter] >> Soaked, right? Soaked in anger. Um No, I mean, I just like I think that Layla and I talk about this a lot that I think oftentimes uh even in in married couples, there's people like people have a proclivity. Like what is your What is your first instinctual or from my perspective, trained reaction to something? And so, anger is a really interesting emotion um because you learn it because it both gets you what you want um and gets bad things away from you.

58:10And so, it's both an avoidance strategy and also a coercion strategy. And so, there's a reason that I think there are some emotions that are more useful than others. Sadness typically doesn't lead to success. >> Mhm. >> Because sadness typically there's you don't take a lot of action when you're depressed. >> Mhm. >> Action when you're angry, take lots of action. Right? >> Big fuel. >> Yeah, big fuel. Um and so, I I've thought a lot about anger because it's probably the one like Layla, for example, she's an anxious person.

58:39So, she she worries. She gets ner- she double-checks. She triple-checks. She quadruple-checks. She just That's That's her That's her proclivity. She acts that way as her as her base. Now, if you were to meet her, you would never say, "Oh, I think she's really anxious." Um because do doing our best and this is where we you know, hold each other accountable and and do our best to help. Um we will try to monitor each other's behavior. Like if I'm angry, the the way to not act angry, at least if you look at some of the the literature, um is to act as if.

59:09Uh which is like you can be angry, what would somebody who's not angry at all, how they act? Do that. >> Be angry, but sin not. >> Mhm? >> Be angry, but sin not. >> Is that Yeah, love it. >> don't act >> how she thought of a Bible thing. I thought of a [laughter] joke in my head. >> Dude, I was like watching them both deal with what they're dealing with. He's like, "Come on, Layla, WHAT THE HELL?" SHE'S LIKE, "YOU'RE RIGHT. I should have thought about that. I should have thought about that." >> [laughter] >> I TOLD YOU, I TOLD YOU, I TOLD YOU. AND THEN THEY ROLL DOWN THE WINDOW, THEY'RE LIKE, "HEY, it's cool." >> Yeah. >> That's cool.

59:36>> [laughter] >> You were not angry. You're not an angry at all. >> No, but I definitely suffer from anger. But the thing is, I think I it's been one of the hardest and they Albert Ellis talks about this in in some of his books. Um it's one of the hardest ones to beat. And of course, I have, you know, with the ego, I'm like, "It's the hardest one to crack." Yeah. Um because it serves you. >> Cuz you get a purpose out of it. >> You Well, one, you get tons of energy from it. Um but two, like if Let's say someone says something to me that I don't like. If I visibly show that I'm angry, they will stop doing that.

1:00:03And so when that happens, I'm reinforced for being angry. Because people like, "Oh, he has a short fuse." But that also means it changes everyone else's behavior around me so they don't piss me off. >> You're absolutely right. >> And so it's difficult, whereas like everyone wants to get someone out of sadness. Um people prefer to get someone out of anger, but it's harder. >> [laughter] >> Right? >> Yeah, but also you're you're saying two things. A lot of people that are like people are scared to piss off are very successful people. Steve Jobs is one of them. People would jump out of the elevator when he was in the elevator.

1:00:31>> And so he used punishment as a as his primary method of changing behavior. And so like you've got carrots and sticks, fundamentally. That's what you've got. >> What carrots and sticks? >> Yeah, I can either make you feel bad for not doing something or make you feel good for doing it. So if I if >> What's carrots and sticks? >> No, carrot like if uh I can give you an incentive for taking action or I can punish you for not taking action. >> Oh, like carrots and >> want to get you to Yeah, yeah, yeah, a stick means you get a stick and you get a carrot. >> Do you think that's ever exhausting though? Like like feeling that anger?

1:00:58Like being in a place where it does it so it does fuel you, right? To keep going and going more, but isn't that exhausting in the way that there is no peace in that anger? >> Oh, for sure. I mean, 100% and I would say that like I'm I mean, Layla will say this for me, so I'm just using her words. Um I'm much better now than I was, you know, when we met a decade ago. Um I actually used to see my anger as like a superpower. As it's like this is what gives me laser-like focus and endless energy. Um, and I remember at one point talking to somebody, you know, you know, a mentor or whatever and I I said like, I like everything that this gives me except it feels like it burns dirty.

1:01:38It's like dirty fuel and I want to but I don't want to sacrifice what I'm doing, what I'm achieving. And so I'm not like I it's like I I I I want to change but like not too much. >> Any chance of saying this in a layer? >> [laughter] >> A cape? I want to stop but I It's so good. No but do you my buddy who was explaining I was explaining that I was going to be on the show with you. He said that you had this thing and he smiled. He goes, oh I know you're not going to like this. And I was like, what? What is it? He says that you use past experiences as like fuel for you to burn at it. And that's why my first question for you was like, would you rather have peace?

1:02:18And when you answered that I was like, wow man, you really just To me it's just I've never met anybody that just willingly looked in my face and said, yeah, I don't know. I don't care about peace. I want I I what what there's this meme of God I wish somebody memes it. He's like, I want problems all the time. >> No, I was Well, I think most people would do that because if they actually wanted they'd behave differently. There's just social norms around it that make it look like bad. But I again, I see money and power as potential energy. Like as a pursuit in and of themselves I think they're completely meaningless and empty but I think using them for good I think is a is a great thing.

1:02:50>> Well, I think you're you're not wrong and the verse that you brought up actually kind of points out your direction. He says, be angry but sin not. You didn't say, oh I got angry and I >> hit my wife. >> Yeah, exactly. >> was the first one that came to mind after you said >> Yeah, yeah. >> [laughter] >> You're not going around screaming at people and and acting upon your anger. So you're saying you're using it as like motivation. >> I do my best but I mean like I'm sure Julian's seen me heated sometimes.

1:03:18>> Yeah, he talked in when we had that song. >> [laughter] >> No, he's great. Yeah, yeah, he's great. He's great. Yeah, yeah. Totally good. Yeah. >> [laughter] >> I'm going to go down to the one gym. >> You know the dog the dog with the fire body? He's like, "Everything is fine. Everything is fine." >> [laughter] >> Um no, but I think to to to like cuz I a because I have certain uh traits and achievements that a lot of younger men aspire towards, they are curious about that specific part. Um and so my advice, and I don't give much from that perspective, but it's use what you have.

1:03:55And so if you like it would be great if it was all sunshine and rainbows and you're like, "I just have this bigger purpose than me and I just want to see this wrong righted in the world." That's amazing. My meaning of the gym was don't be broke. That was my my raison d'être. That was all it was, right? >> What was What did you just say? >> It reason reason for being. >> What is what? >> It's a It's a French term. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. Raison d'être. >> Sounds Jewish. >> Raison raison d'être. I think it's that that yeah.

1:04:21>> Oh, can you be serious? Oh. >> Why don't you step up here, dude? >> Well, I'm so I don't want to That's so annoying. >> Parisian? >> Let me tell you how we would say it, brother. That's so annoying. I Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm I'm I was born in Thionville, so I'm not Parisian, but I guess I kind of am. We were like we lived close by. >> When did you come here? >> I left when I was 10 and then I lived in Canada for 6 years and then I moved to California. >> Oh, sick. >> Yep. >> Yeah, no, my mother's Parisian. >> Oh, she is? >> Yeah. >> Wow. >> Yeah. So, anyways. >> Your your good mom the >> Yeah, all right. Yeah,

1:04:48>> [laughter] >> done. >> The first thing I'm going to meet I'm going to be like, "Why did you rat on him?" >> Yeah. Spark Trump. >> Wait, and she has I'm so sorry. Can I veer off? And she has faith. And she's When did she leave France? >> Four. >> Oh, she was four? >> was born here. Or no, she's raised here. Yeah. But she came to Christ much later. She was like in her 40s. >> She was? >> Yeah. >> Do you mind Do you mind if you tell us how she found her relationship with God? >> Um well, I think she was Oh, no, she Yeah, I think she was just dissatisfied with life and I think her secretary was Christian and then started taking her to church. Um, that was it.

1:05:19>> Got it. And then she followed that path. >> Yeah. >> Okay, so I was just curious cuz there's not a lot There's just right now totally different thought, but go on. >> Oh, uh, for the for the young men, um, yes, there So, they don't have to have some big big purpose of being, right? It's just like if you're ashamed of your current situation, use that. If you're angry about something some girl said to you that you're broken you can't take her on a date, use that. Use whatever you can to get to where you want to go and over time, you will have more resources and more skills to correct action.

1:05:49>> I mean, I did use that. Oh, sorry. I did use that when I was a kid uh, getting made fun of never really affected me. I I kind of just took it that I was like a loser and I was like, "Ah, this isn't me." But, how they made my mom feel really crushed me. So, I worked really hard so that way they could give honor to my mom wiping away all the times that she had to come to school crying about me. So, I I used that anger and I channeled it there. So, I agree with you there. Yeah, that's cool.

1:06:18>> And there is such thing as righteous anger. >> Yeah. >> Right? Not saying I have that, but >> [laughter] >> Uh, do you feel like >> I feel nothing. >> That's what you did. >> [laughter] >> Every time I say, "Do you feel?" I'm like >> I'm talking to Batman Where is she? >> [laughter] >> So, question, does that ever get in involved with your guys' relationship with your girls like, "Come on, bro, I need some more emotion out of you." Or are you too like calculated with everything?

1:06:46>> No, also the way I present to you is not the way I present to my wife. >> And you said you cry mostly joyful tears. >> Yeah, I'll get choked up for gratitude. As a total side note, one of the things that I think, um, that has has I would say has I don't know if I'm in the position to say this, but what I've witnessed from the outside is that I feel like from from the experience I had from the inside of the church versus what I can observe today from the outside of it is that I feel like um a lot of modern Christianity has softened masculinity.

1:07:15And I think that that is to the detriment of men. >> Yeah. Well, we're just all boys. >> Yeah, so there's a lot of men that look at God's features and they only look at the lamb >> Yeah. >> and they forget the lion. >> And I was going to bring it up earlier when you said like, you know, God's not the the God who condemns and all of that. I was like, the Old Testament God for sure [ __ ] was. >> [laughter] >> So, God had a wrath. >> Yeah. >> Yes, but okay, so the no condemnation in those who are in Christ [laughter] Jesus.

1:07:40Yeah, yeah, yeah, he condemns, man. >> Yeah, yeah, he brings the heat. >> Sodom and Gomorrah. They're like, "There, gone." Uh [laughter] like that. Dude, I always talk about that, but you know what I I love about his wrath? It's never torture. It's always like that. The flood, uh the light, the salt. Anytime God ever punished somebody, he never tortures them. So, when you feel like you're being tortured through your thoughts, it's never Jesus. Jesus motivates you out of love. Like he he he wants to make you

1:08:07>> All carrots. >> Yes. >> No stakes. >> Yeah, but again, he'll lean in and be like, "You're above 50, you're going to die 5 years early." >> [laughter] >> You're going to meet me 5 years earlier than you should. I don't know if you should. Um >> But this is a really good point to bring up because we do know a lot of Christian girls who, you know, are very strong in their faith and for them, they want a man obviously who is really strong in their faith and their relationship with God, but they feel like they're too soft and they're like, "We want a manly man who has a deep relationship with Jesus, but we want a manly man." So,

1:08:36>> Do you know what happens to the manly men? They walk away and start their own faith. Few too many push-ups for you, my friend. >> Yeah. >> You at 3,000, you're like, "Wait a second, Jesus doesn't exist." He just keeps going and does push-ups. Too dark? Okay, sorry. >> No, you're good. >> Everybody in the room got really quiet. All right, all right. [laughter] >> No, but I No, I No, but I mean, again, to the degree that I can comment from the outside, so I understand my position.

1:09:03Yeah, it just seems like an observation that I have that I think I think the church would win a significant more larger amount of young men over because like there's the manosphere and the red pill and all that stuff. Um and I think the reason that that resonated with so many young men is because they felt unseen and unheard and they felt weak and they felt not allowed to be men. They felt condemned for being men. And I think that the church would do a better job of welcoming them in by leaning into the elements of masculinity that are biblical. But I think that have been largely um softened.

1:09:36Like I think there's a lot of edge to the Bible which I would say a lot of modern-day larger megachurch tickle-your-ears type gospel doesn't hit. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> That's why I feel like I would I would love I would love to I'd love to sit with you and walk with you with at least my mentors like the that aspect is very true and I I just keep pinning it man that like and this is my heart. I don't know you. So I'm just saying [laughter] off of what I feel. Like my feelings could be meaningless. My intent could be completely off. But I feel like from what I've absorbed in this conversation there was a lot less evidence of his existence through his own church. And so it makes only sense to a man who's veering through life as a child trying to see what actually is and what actually isn't for you to walk into a church and them not be Christ-like, I too would walk away.

1:10:41I did. That's why I understand. And then when I You know what it was? It took me a minute to realize that I have to hold responsibility for myself. If that man chooses not to act that way fine. I can motivate him or manipulate him. But at the end of the day, I am just the sower. I'm not the grower.

1:11:06The The seeds that I'm planting and how it's coming up forth has nothing to do with me. It has to do with him. So, I try not to sit there and really measure everybody around me because that I do feel like you fall on your sword then because I'm either going to be measuring too high up or I'm going to be measuring too far down. And then I'm starting to to measure myself in a world that we both know is broken. Like it's a broken world. >> So, really interesting you say this because there was a sermon that I heard um 9 years ago when Layla and I went to church.

1:11:38Um that was about this topic which was about, you know, judgment. Um and you know, it's like judge not lest you be judged, something to that degree. And the pastor who I think was phenomenal, Steve Smotherman, shout out to Albuquerque. Um he he had this he delivered this great sermon about he's like, "God is not saying you should not judge." Um as in like you should not meet someone and say, "I think this person's going to try and rob me." You should use judgment. If someone's swerving on the road in front of you, you should use judgment.

1:12:07Right? It's more so um saying whether they are labeling the all of the their being as good or bad. And I think that's the at least this is my That was my interpretation of the sermon that I that I kind of took to heart. And so, I only bring that up because it was if it was something that um you had struggled with with the people around and again, this is not me this I'm sharing this if it's useful. Not for me, from Pastor Steve. Um >> What you're describing is righteously judging.

1:12:35>> Yeah. >> So, >> Measuring. I mean, fundamentally and this might be interesting >> does. >> Yes. >> But there's some people that abuse it. >> So, this might be interesting from an employee perspective to make this businessy. Um A lot of people don't know the difference between a criticism and an insult. >> That's true. >> And so a criticism is communicating a discrepancy between actual and desired. >> Yeah. >> You said you were going to be here at 8:00. You're at 8:05. I'm communicating you were 5 minutes late. All this is factual.

1:13:06If I then say, "And you're a lazy piece of shit." >> [snorts] >> That is an insult. And so when people are like, "Oh man, he's he's he's always criticizing me." It's like, "Well, is he criticizing you or is he insulting you?" Now, it happens both ways where someone takes that where I say, "You said you were going to be here at 8:00." You're at 8:00 here at 8:05. You're 5 minutes late. And it's like, "This guy's always on my case."

1:13:28Was 8:00 our agreement? Is 8:05 untrue? No, I'm stating facts. And so one of the things that we obviously teach internally is like we want like feedback is fuel. That's one of our things, right? So like we want to give someone as much fuel as possible. We want to have many feedback cycles as we possibly can and then um take away the emotional charge of feedback. It's like this is only because we want you to get better faster. >> Yeah. Yeah. And >> Right. >> Praise God, that's what we do in our relationship. I always tell her like, "Hey, if we put if we keep getting offended every time we bring something up

1:13:59>> Yeah. >> we're never going to want to bring anything up." >> Right. >> Mhm. Yeah. And you know >> Imagine the business. >> [sighs] >> I'm a bad businessman. >> You're like great husband. >> [laughter] >> Dude, at 8:05 I was like, "Hey, at least it wasn't 8:10." >> Dude, you're doing great. >> I high-five him. I'm like, "You want McDonald's? I'm going." >> I'm buying. >> But he even says that. He's like, "If you really love like if you really love your sister, you'd sit her down and have the hard conversation with her." >> Yeah.

1:14:24>> Like right? Like not telling somebody the truth is going to like it's going to hurt them more than having that tough combo. >> I mean, I feel like you have to at some point. But can think about this, bro. Like I had this conversation with you. Walking into it you said, "I'm a little nervous about it." You're nervous about it. I was nervous about it. You're you're very adequate with your words. I don't even know if I used that word right. Like you'd like [laughter] you're very very good with your words. You know how to talk. You know how to like demand a room, and you coach people. I just have a belief and I like care enough about you to share it. I just the way I go about is one day I'm going to be standing before God. And God goes, "Hey, did you talk Did you talk to Alex?" And what am I going to say? "Oh, I was on a podcast. I didn't want to be showed up on my own podcast." What do you mean, the podcast that I gave you so you could share the good news? Yeah, yeah, but I I didn't like well, you know, like he was pretty firm on it. Like I didn't want to keep pushing. Like, "Yeah, but you knew it was true."

1:15:17I'm like, "Yeah, I didn't know it was true." So, at some point I would have to hate you to put my own selfish pride and my how people look at me over the fact that I could get my ass kicked in a conversation. But I at least want to try and attempt to reach for your heart and say, "Hey, Alex, I think you should Don't judge the church, man. Like Like they they they are My my mom used to tell me this cuz I used I I had that moment where I was like, "Bro, what the Where's God's people, dog?" Where are they? And my mentor said, "If there's a perfect church and you find it, don't go."

1:15:49>> Yeah. >> Because if you go, you'll ruin it. >> Yeah. It's not a museum for saints. It's a hospital for sinners. >> Amen. >> Yeah. I know I don't I'm not really criticizing the church. >> [laughter] >> No, no, I would just say that at all. >> No. >> Um first of all, I appreciate you letting us come here >> Yeah. >> and shooting with you. I really do appreciate it. And uh I would love to connect uh outside of the podcast to just talk to you about faith and then also business and like get your brain and

1:16:16>> business and things. >> Business and things. >> All right. Rock and roll. >> Is there anything you wanted to share with them before you leave? >> Thank you. >> That's it. >> [laughter] >> Thank you so much. >> Hey, thank you guys so much for watching. What an incredible episode. We'll be back for part two when we baptize him. >> [laughter] >> And he's going to be He's Dude, he's going to be the front charge. He'll be like, "Listen, man, this is how we do it." And then I'll be like, "Dude, dude, too much anger." And he'll be like, "No, we use it as fuel." All right. But, thanks guys. I'll see you guys next time. Peace.

1:16:47We we got off we got off the podcast and he started getting deep with me again and I was like, "Dude, don't do that. We're not on the podcast anymore." He says, [laughter] "No, this how I run all the time." And then as a joke I said, "Well, run it back right now." He says, "I got time." And I was like, "Wow, this guy is he's the man." So. >> [laughter] >> There was a conversation I was tiptoeing around I didn't want to bring up, but it was about your childhood. Like, how was your relationship with your dad? >> Uh really good, then really bad, then really good. >> Is there any way you could like >> Yeah, that was it, right? That's what we were going

1:17:14>> [laughter] >> All right, thanks for coming back, guys. >> Yeah, I would say that um my relationship with my father from called zero to I don't know 13 was probably like what you'd consider like a perfect father. Um I think he he didn't miss a single game ever. He picked me up from school, he dropped me off from school. He was a surgeon. He chose to end work every day at 2:00 so he could pick me up. Um he always talked about how he's like, "At the end of my life I'm going to have the choice of having more money or more time with you and I'm always going to pick more time with you." And so that was that was like that was my dad.

1:17:47Um that being said, he's a strong-willed guy. Um and I was raised by a single father more or less. Um so I was raised predominantly by my dad. Um especially as I got older, which I actually think is a good thing. But um I definitely needed a strong hand. Uh and so but as a result of that uh he and I did not get super along for I mean we would, you know, text once every, you know, couple weeks like, "Hello. Hello.

1:18:15Okay. Thanks." >> In the same home? >> No, no, no. After I No, so like in high school, sure. I mean, I think I was just a normal high schooler who just like >> What What separated you guys cuz like you said he was a perfect dad. What What What behaviors or patterns changed for you to >> Um I think that my dad wanted me to behave the way that he wanted me to behave and I didn't want to do that. >> Was this when you were a man though?

1:18:41>> Well, I was trying to be a man. >> Oh, so you were a teenager? >> Yeah, I'm 16, 17, you know, and I you know, now you look back and you're like, "Okay, these are normal developmental stages." Um, but you know, there's separation that has to have you know, has to occur, otherwise you can't kind of be your own person. Um, but yeah, we just had a lot of conflict. Um, and I would say the top the number of topics that we could talk about without arguing just gotten narrower and narrower and narrower until it was almost like just the weather. Um, >> Dang. >> and I would say that it was that way for a period of years.

1:19:08Um, there I I didn't feel as though he supported the entrepreneurial path that I chose to take. I was the prodigal son, finished Vanderbilt in 3 years, magna [ __ ] laude, uh, went to you know, defense contracting, nice white collar job, sounded good for him to you know, tell his friends, "Okay, my my kid's actually you know, doing good things." Then I quit, drive across the country with no notice and call him from halfway and say that I'm going to go be a personal trainer. And so it's like, "Wait, what?"

1:19:36Um, and I was like, "Well, I'm going to follow my passion, right?" Um, and so he wasn't the biggest fan of it. Um, I think if you were to ask him, he'd say he supported it the whole time. I would say I >> [laughter] >> I don't know if I that was communicated the way I would have heard it. Yeah. Um, and so probably for a period of like five or so years, it was um, I just we didn't we didn't super talk. Every once in a while I'd go home and I really hated going home. Um, and so I avoided it um, to the greatest degree possible and I just kept you know, being pretty locked in on work.

1:20:09Um, and I definitely had I would say unwarranted anger towards my dad because he wasn't following the perfect father ideal that I had in my mind of what he should have done or should have acted. Um, but uh, he and I are fine now. We buried the hatchet, you know, a while ago. But, I would say that the my consolidated like if I could consolidate the feelings that got me over it or the sentiment that got me over the anger that I had. And I really do feel like I'm pretty close to over it. Um I might be over it.

1:20:45Um was that my father did the best he could with what he had. And who am I to say that's not good enough for me? And so, um yeah, I mean I think I think in terms of intentions, if we were to if we were to use them, I think I would judge my father as having perfect intentions.

1:21:10>> If you could implement something and and take something away when it comes to raising your kid, what what would you say? >> Tons of things from my dad. Tons. Tons. >> Um I mean, he was literally physically always there for me. You know what I mean? Like every practice, every game, everything. He was always there. >> And that meant a lot to you? >> I didn't know any different, to be fair. I only realized how how crazy that is now.

1:21:37>> Yeah. >> And that he gave up career, you know, what that meant for him, you know, more offices or, you know, more surgeries or whatever, you know, whatever measurement um to do that. And he never once showed even an ounce of regret, resentment, anything. He was happy to do it. >> He never held it above your head. >> Never once. Never once. >> And is is that something you want to do with your child or you are you going to want to be around or you sacrificing yourself?

1:22:05>> No. No, I mean, I see that if if the purpose of what we do, so I define a life's purpose by the output of that life. So, what was the the meaning of this person's life is what happened as a result. And did nothing happen as a result? Did a lot of good things happen as a result? Well, that was the meaning, right? Um I actually said this on Impulsive um because we talked for a while about business stuff and then we just got deep all of a sudden halfway through.

1:22:34Um, but uh one of my favorite uh Albert Camus quotes is the the meaning of your life is the reason you don't kill yourself. It's very dark, but fundamentally it's like you just ask someone it's like, "Why don't you kill yourself?" And they're like, "Well, I mean, I couldn't my my wife, my kids." Like I you know, and he's like, "Great. That is your meaning. That is why you were here." And so it's like that is the opposite of my work, my what whatever thing comes into mind when when you answer that question are the things that are most meaningful for you, and that is why. Um but to to to circle back to the original question of like, what am I going to take from my dad? I will always physically I mean, I'll do my absolute best to be physically present. Um I think that my dad was very good at managing the line between especially in the earlier years of love and respect.

1:23:20Which is like my dad had zero tolerance for disrespect. Um but he always I always felt like I've never questioned that my father loved me. >> Mhm. >> Never. I would say that the way that he showed that love was maybe harder for me to understand at different periods or chapters of my life. Um, but even when he disagreed with actions that I took um and that may have been painful for me at the time um I can now look back and say that I I know that he why he was doing it. Um and so yeah, I think one of my favorite quotes from Pascal who was a Christian mathematician um was uh to understand is to forgive.

1:24:02And to be clear, I'm not saying my dad did anything wrong. But my belief was that he had wronged me in some way. Um me demanding that he be perfect. Um but uh I think I have a deeper understanding of my father and his intentions. And as a result, like he and I are good. >> How did you first come to amends with your father? >> [sighs] >> I wish I could say it was one magical conversation, but I think it was just over time. I I grew up like I'd love to say that, you know, we had this one moment we both cried and hugged or something, but it wasn't that. I mean, we had a conversation where at one point, you know, um he was like, "Is it all right if we just start over?

1:24:42Just fresh slate, we just don't talk about the past." And I was like, "I'm good with that." And so we've more or less tried to look forward rather than looking back. And that's been super helpful. >> I pray that you guys are like it's not even that you're trying to forget, but you forget. You know what I mean? Like it's >> on. >> Yeah, it's it's something that like there's so much new, better memories that kind of fade the old ones away.

1:25:11>> It literally only lives in your mind. >> Yeah. >> This is wild. >> That book that you're quoting about that Christian guy, >> Mhm. >> um Pascal? >> Pascal. Blaise Pascal. >> Um >> Might have been French. >> Pascal sounds sounds French. Uh the last thing Jesus said on the cross was, "Forgive them, for they don't know." >> Yeah. >> Um and I think I was actually dabbling this idea with Bell.

1:25:37The the there's a thing that I've been with myself battling is it's self-worship. >> Mhm. >> Um and it's so hard to bring it up, especially on a podcast, because >> How do you worship yourself? >> Subscribe. >> [laughter] >> And uh but I I I think there's a there's a level of worshipping yourself in in a place where you the people around you need to see you the way that you see you.

1:26:07And I've gotten a lot more peace from understanding that everybody's life is so much more complicated than I understand it to be. And when I put myself in the middle of it, I become God. And I'm like, well, how could he or how should she or or all that? But when I pull myself back and I'm like, well, you know, I'm not the center of their universe. Like, they're probably figuring this out for themselves. It gives me a lot of peace.

1:26:30Is it hard to do that with a father, somebody that should really be at the center of like where you're at? Is it harder to forgive a family member than it is like your wife or or uh uh I I apologize. What's the gentleman's name over there? >> Julian. China. >> Julian. China. >> [snorts] [laughter] >> Um I think that and first I'll just I'll just restate the fact that I I don't think I I don't think my my father needs to be forgiven, to be clear. I think that it was my issue, not his.

1:27:06>> Oh. >> Um That said, I think that um the difficulty of So, basically, it's like, how do we find forgiveness, right? So, I think I defining forgiveness would be acting as if a transgression or an adverse behavior had not happened. And so, if you can return to original function, original behavior the same as basically baseline prior, then I would say that you have forgiven the person.

1:27:35And so, I think it becomes more difficult with the number of negative interactions you've had with the person. And so, I don't know if it has anything to do with family. It's just that family you might have had more interactions with than anybody else. >> So, a lot more to forgive. >> I think there's a lot of divorces that would say that they had a harder time forgiving their ex than they did their parents. >> You actually said something to me the other day that stuck with me. He says, uh building a forgiveness is easy until it gets to resentment.

1:28:02>> Hm. >> And I think once your heart becomes resentful, it's harder for you to like draw the line to want to forgive. But I also tell people that people need to ask for forgiveness. People give forgiveness to people that don't even want it. Have you ever been in that type of relationship where you're like forgiving someone like, "Dude, I don't know. I I didn't ask for it." >> So, that's really interesting because I I actually find that really interesting. Because I think the biggest transgressions that happen to us happen from people who don't believe they need forgiveness, which is what Like if someone asks you to forgive them, it takes a special kind of, you know, anger to say I don't care. I'm still angry at you.

1:28:43Most people if they humble [snorts] themselves enough to say, "I transgressed. I messed up. I'm sorry. Please forgive me." Someone says that, it's very humbling. And it's very hard to say, "Screw you." I think the the more common situation is where you have somebody in your life who might have had all of those things but has no desire to be forgiven because they don't see what they did as wrong. And so you basically suck you have the memory of the consequence but with zero for quote remorse from the other person.

1:29:13And so I think um I think Tupac said it best. Um >> [laughter] >> But he said uh >> That theologian? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think said um something degree of uh Just because Just because I Just because we're not friends anymore doesn't mean I don't want you to eat.

1:29:37You just can't eat at my table. >> Okay. >> Looks >> I don't accept apologies that are like not real. >> [laughter] >> Okay. >> Do you ever have that or no? >> I don't have that many people apologize to me to be fair. >> You probably terrify >> I don't have all these people who are like, "I'm so sorry, Alex." It's just like [laughter] If someone says that, I'm like, "You're good, dude. Like we're going to die. It's going to be fine." >> He just goes, "I have no feelings. I told you."

1:30:02Uh but like when me and Belle first started dating, yeah, she'd be like she would say something like uh I'm making this is this is a made-up example, but she's like, "I'm sorry that you feel." And I was like, "Feel?" I go, "You just put it back on me." >> you don't like feelings. Okay. >> Yeah, like >> Oh, just so we're clear. >> I was like, "Babe, babe, don't apologize if you don't feel like you you should apologize. Don't uh just don't do it. If you don't feel like you need to apologize, don't apologize. But if you feel like you apologize, apologize correctly. Don't put the blame on the person and be like, "Sorry you feel like I was coming at you."

1:30:35>> This is great. I love this. So, I I'm lit- probably the exact opposite. I care zero for apologies. I just want you to not do that. >> [laughter] >> Just don't do it. >> I care about the outcome, not the intention. If you apologize to me every single time and nothing changes, I don't care. I want you to change. >> I say this all the time. I go, "Bro, like I don't accept apologies cuz I know you're going to apologize it again for it, and to me it's pointless. We're just wasting time here." But dude, I love the way your brain work, and I need a little bit more of it. Because I am tired of being a a hamster in a hamster wheel, bro. Like I feel like I go through so many redundant things that make me angry, and then I do sin, even though I don't want to sin. Like I get angry and then I sin, and I don't want to do it.

1:31:21How do you get yourself there? Have you ever been like me and normal human beings where like Have you ever been not a robot? >> [laughter] >> Hollin, like just operate off of emotions, or you just one day like, "You know what? Never doing that again." >> Overrated. >> Yeah, [laughter] overrated. No. >> No, of course. Um I think again, it's just like, how does this thing change my behavior? And does that behavior help me or hurt me? You know, again, I speak in these very literal terms cuz I want no room for miscommunication, not because I always talk this way. Um but it's just easy Basically, instead of using shorthand, I have to say longer sentences with more words to be more precise with language, rather than just saying, um yeah, I've been a human for of course I feel stuff.

1:32:01>> [laughter] >> Yeah, of course I do. Um, but to the the point that we're making before, which is like, how? Um, I think I said at the very beginning of this, people are very surprised by their lives, and they're like, I don't know how I got here. Why didn't Why didn't these things work? It's because they're I think most people do not see reality accurately. And so, they take action, and they're like, that didn't work. And that's a lot of their lives is things that didn't go the way I thought it was going to go.

1:32:28And it's because they have poor language to describe the world around them, and they were taught with vague language, and so everything's fuzzy. There are no sharp edges. And the more, again, we can only look at inputs and outputs, it simplifies the world to just a shocking degree, and your ability to predict what's going to happen goes up dramatically. And so, in thinking like, I'll give you a I'll give you a a very real marriage example of my worldview applied. So, Leila, if we get into a disagreement, sometimes will cry.

1:33:02Earlier on in our marriage, less so now, I'm not perfect. Um, I'm imperfect. But earlier on in our marriage, I would get angry when she cried. And what would happen is like, I would try to console. Nothing would happen. I try to console again, nothing would happen, and then I would get angry cuz I'm like, there's no winning. I can't do anything. And then, I would escalate, and then, you know, she would, you know, stop crying cuz now she's afraid, right? Cuz I would get angry.

1:33:29And what's interesting is that I it took me time to realize, and this is through this worldview, that I she was like, why do you like I I hate that you get angry when I cry. And the reason that I would get angry when she cried, I realized only later, was because it was the only thing that would get her to stop crying. >> Mhm. >> And so, I was reinforced for getting angry because it was the thing that got her to stop doing the crying.

1:33:55And so, we think about these cycles within relationships of like what is reinforcing this behavior, what is not reinforcing this behavior. The reason that people fight or get into these situations because they've been reinforced for fighting. >> Yeah. >> Like my big why for everything is that we've been rewarded for doing so in the past. Either we had some bad thing that went away or some good thing happened as a result. That's it. >> Yeah. >> And the reward cycles, you don't have to be cognizant of them for them to work. >> What did you do because I have somebody in my life

1:34:22>> Mhm. >> uh that I work alongside. Yeah, not my wife, by the way, cuz every time I say that everybody thinks it's my wife. >> Sure. >> But there's Sure, buddy. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> Sure. You guys have a long ride ahead. >> like we're so honest about everything. If it was me, he'd say it was me, you know. >> Oh, yeah. >> [laughter] >> That's honestly true. That's She's not a liar. There's so many times she's like You know my mom watches this podcast too, right? >> Uh but I have this thing I I I did the other day where I noticed I was like, "Oh, this person doesn't hear me unless I snap." >> Mhm.

1:34:48>> And so, I wrote it down and I said, "Hey, I'm going to snap, but I actually don't mean it." And I snapped, bro. >> Yeah. >> And they're like, "No, no, no, I got it." And I said, "Dude, that's really shitty that I have to be the person that I'm running away from >> Mhm. >> for you to be able to work with me here." >> Mhm. >> That I feel like there's a lot of people that act in a way that they don't want to behave anymore because they no longer know how to communicate with somebody they love without getting to that level.

1:35:15What did you do to get out of that? >> What would you like me to do next time to get you to stop crying? >> So, just ask them. >> Yeah. Tell me what to do. I will do that. >> What did she say if you don't mind me asking? >> Tell me I'm beautiful, tell me you love me, and tell me it's all going to be okay. >> Mhm. >> And hug me. >> Yeah. Makes sense. >> That works pretty good. >> Did that, and how did you >> Crushes. >> And he was [laughter] as in He He sees me at a bank and then I just hug a random guy. You're beautiful. I love you.

1:35:47>> [laughter] >> I like road rage. Sorry. >> Yeah, and I think everyone has have has whatever that cheat code is. I mean, whatever yours is is might be different, but like it's I think and so we've just again, we share the same worldview and that has made this so much easier because we use the same language to describe the world. And so when we had the realization that like I get angry when she gets sad because it gets sort of stop acting sad, not that she stops being sad, right? She stops behaving that way. I was like, "Okay, you crying is becomes a code 10 red alert for me as a as a man." Like if my wife is crying, basically nothing else in the world matters to me. It's just like get this to stop. Whatever it is, kill the tiger or like get it to stop.

1:36:28And then and so when she understood that it was like it really bothered me that she cried, um she still cries. It's fine. Because I I know how I have tools now that I can use, right? And so I felt powerless because I there was nothing I could do. And it was just cuz I was doing the wrong thing. And so um I'll give you a different translation I think might be helpful or interesting for the audience. One of the very first things that Leila and I did um when we got married is we went through all the uh divorce rehabilitation uh like courses for like the like your marriage is in a crisis, what do you go through? So we went through all these trainings and courses and seminars um so we could just be like, "Okay, well, what are all the things that end marriages?

1:37:07Let's try to avoid those." And >> That's smart. >> Yeah. >> Very analytical. >> Super helpful. >> robot. >> [laughter] >> We should join them. See how they fail. >> Avoid [laughter] Avoid failure. And >> China built you, didn't they? He's the mastermind behind this, huh? >> [laughter] >> And um and so we created this thing. So like another classic marriage example.

1:37:31Uh why don't you love me? What do you mean I don't love you? I pay the bills, I take out the trash, I I go to work every single day. Like uh I I I I I I clean up the the house. Like W- how how do you how can you say that I don't love you? It's you're well, that's that's not love. I define love as Oh. So, I don't have to do all that stuff anymore and then I can do that list instead? And so, we just made a cheat code of what is the perfect day for me to you? Just tell me what that day would look like. Is it a nice note in the morning? Is it a shoulder rub when we get home? Is it for me dinner cooked on the table? Like, what how how do you want me to show love? What is a perfect day? And I'm not saying that you're going to like just show me what perfect is. I'm not going to hit it.

1:38:19Just show me what it is. And what was astonishing is when we actually wrote down what perfect day looks like, it was like not that hard. >> Yeah. >> [clears throat] >> It was just do these things. It was like, oh, and I remember being like, this? This is it? And she was like, yeah. And I was like, >> [snorts] >> done. >> [laughter] >> Easy. I have time left over. What am I going to do with my with my extra time, right? >> Yeah. >> Um But again, it's translating these amorphous terms into into things that people can do. And so, I think this has been a a a point of great fascination for me because I've just been like, I don't know what that means. And not because uh I like I'm a And I don't a- ask those questions cuz I want to bother people. I ask it because like I genuinely don't know what that word means for you.

1:38:58And I want to make sure what it means for you when you're saying it is how I'm understanding it so we can communicate. >> Has this helped you in other relationships? >> it helps me in everything. Like my cheat code on life is simply trying to ask people what they mean by that. And then translating that so that we can actually communicate. Most conversations, people make face noise at each other. >> They don't understand >> And then walk away. >> Dude. >> I notice this. >> Mhm. >> I notice this all the time. I literally can't tell you how many times I walk away and I'll ask people in the group, what did you get out of this?

1:39:30It's like, have you ever played telephone game where somebody's listening to another thing? I'm like, was I in the same room as you guys? >> Yeah. >> Everybody's perspective is so different. And that's something that I just recently started applying for myself because if you do something and I think that I think I know what you meant by that or by that slight face that you made or the exhale that you made, I created this reality for myself that I believe and I don't say anything to you about, right? Even something that I might do in my marriage, right? I think that he's upset by something and I don't ask him, "Why did you say this like this or that?" Whatever. So, now you have this problem that he doesn't even know about, right? Because it hasn't been communicated. And then that arises so many other problems afterwards. And so, it's just like

1:40:09>> I do that a lot. >> communicate issue. >> I'm not going to lie, I do that a lot. I'll like If some like for example, if you're if I feel like you're upset with this interview, I like put in my brain like, "Oh, he wants to wrap this up because of this." But it it I just make it up. So, a lot of people go off of what they think that they know. Okay, so this is what I'm figuring this out. You just understood that and realized that like you just have to be the better communicator in the room.

1:40:34>> I try not to judge it by ranking of who's the best communicator, but it was more like I just want to understand what they're trying to tell me. >> You could lead the communication. >> There's a purpose for you talking. >> trying to put him as a leader. >> You're leading the communication. >> There's a purpose Yeah, yeah. There's a purpose >> Alpha. I goes, "Dude, what are you doing?" I just I just ask questions. >> Yeah. Teacher. >> [laughter] >> Like there's a purpose for you talking to me right now. What would you like me to do? And so, just asking like what would you I I One of the most common things I'll ask, especially to the like the leadership team things like that if I have a one-on-one where they come say a lot of words at me.

1:41:06I just say like "What would you like me to do as a result of this conversation?" Cuz there was some intention which I I would define as a desired outcome, right? Like if I have good intentions, bad intentions, whatever. But my intent for this is that I would hope your behavior changes in this way. Right? Um and so, if we can just be really clear on that, then it gets so much of the noise of like, "I feel this way and you said this thing." It's just like just what would you like me to do? It's like, "Next time, can you just say please?"

1:41:35>> Sure. >> Easy. No problem. And if the thing that they asked me to do is somehow in conflict then I'll be like, I'm not willing to do that. So, what can we do from here? >> Mhm. >> It just gets to the core of everything much faster and I think that in a world where there's endless communication, having filters to translate that into actual behavior is probably one of the highest value filters that you can have to predict reality and then also be able to take in data and know what to do with it. And so I'll give you a different example. This is a super business one.

1:42:03If I want to judge how good someone is at a job, I want to ask them or I'll ask them like, so what metrics do you track to know that you're doing a good job? First question. And if someone has no metrics, it's going to be tough. Let's say they have decent metrics. All right, they they name five things, I'm thinking of seven, but they've got five of them. Okay, that's fine. The next question is, how does what you do change them?

1:42:28Because if you I mean, the first level of understanding is like, these are the outcomes. These are the variables that create the outcome. Great. How does your behavior affect the variables? If you can describe that, you'll probably likely be very competent at your job. It's very simple, but most people cannot do that, which is why most people are not competent. Like competence is incredibly rare. >> Are you I feel like he was waiting on me. Bloody >> [laughter]

1:42:53>> Why did he stare at me for so long after he said that, dude? He says, "Incompetence is extremely rare." >> [laughter] >> I was like >> It is rare. You know what else is rare? Common sense. >> So, um >> He has [laughter] a point. >> Yeah, super interesting. So, when you say common sense, I've actually thought I've I've given some thought to this. Like, so when you say common sense, what do you think that means? >> Oh lord. I put myself there. I put myself there.

1:43:20>> it. I didn't. I was just staring at him like this. >> And I and I say this in no way to try and I do it because but this is a perfect example of so two things. One is I'm sure you've heard someone say like, "Does that make sense?" >> Yeah. >> We are rewarded for immediately saying, "Yeah, totally." >> Mhm. >> It has nothing to do with whether you actually understand it. We just know that when that sound comes out of someone else's mouth, we need to nod and say yes. >> That does make sense. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> [laughter]

1:43:46>> Exactly. >> Dude, he hits us with some silence, dog. And I'm just like, "What do I do? >> [laughter] >> I've never been here before. What do I do? Do I answer? Do I sit here quietly? What do I do?" >> And so, with common sense, of course it's like common sense isn't that common. It's a It's It's a It's a you know, it's it's a funny It's a funny term, but I would translate common sense for most people as um behaving the way that I would behave in the same condition.

1:44:12It's common sense. Behave the way that I would behave in that condition. >> Yeah, cuz you're saying like you're saying >> Be like me. Do what I would >> Like true like Yeah, like truth is subjective in a way. Like right like somebody is their >> I wouldn't say truth is subjective. >> Their belief system. >> Yeah. >> Their behaviors that they've been rewarded for doing so. They had a condition. >> sense is their >> They acted differently. In this condition, you would act They do A in this situation, you would do B. You say they have no common sense.

1:44:41>> Yeah. >> You just learned a different lesson >> Yeah. >> than they did in those same circumstances. I'll tell you a different story. I had um a teammate um who uh I've spent a lot of time with, I've mentored a lot. And amazing amazing person in terms of their work, as a human being, everything. And one day they I realized that they had made a gigantic mistake. Like huge mistake. Um like a 10 you know, not 10 figures. Like a $10 million cost mistake. Like real cost mistake.

1:45:15>> Yeah. >> And it was a younger person on the team. And I found out about it and I, you know, confronted them and I was angry cuz it's like How could you not know this? This is ridiculous blah blah blah. And I could see how hurt, you know, the person was by this attack. And he, you know, was just like, I was just trying to do a good job.

1:45:44And I remember in that moment I was like I cannot hold you accountable to not knowing something that I should have taught you. It is my mistake, not yours. And so because I was the one who had taught him a lot of the role cuz I, you know, I I He built the Yeah, exactly. You know, I took him under my wing, etc. And so but it was a it was a great example of like he had no common sense. But it wasn't common sense. It was extremely rare sense. A rare sense that I have cuz I'm very good at whatever the thing is, right? And so it's so unfair for me to say you should have lived every single experience of my life and behaved exactly as I would have behaved except never having taught them that.

1:46:31>> Yeah. >> But we we talk about this all the time. The way that I put it is don't punish the man like that's next to you that doesn't have what you have. Like for example, if God gave you wisdom to understand that or walk through a life for you to have that ability, don't punish the man that doesn't have it. It doesn't make sense to punish him. He doesn't have it. So it's like it's like God punishing us for not being God. It's impossible. I I'm not God. I have to learn and so when I'm learning, I've also learned that what I have is given to me from God. So who am I to punish another person? But how do you how do you separate this because that's still $10 million, bro. And also like I'm not emotional but the first person I think about is all these people's mouths that could have been fed off of it.

1:47:12>> But it was my fault. You you just put it on your side. It was my fault. >> Well, then shame on you, bro. >> But it was my fault. It was my fault. It was 100% my fault. >> Are you guys still cool? >> Oh, 100 100%. I mean, I said that in the moment. After it's now I was like >> You really >> This is my fault. >> Yeah. >> Like I saw the and I was like Like it's so common that we will attribute to malice what is more commonly incompetence. And I say that in a formal sense, not that it's anyone needs anyone's dumb. They just don't have whatever skill was needed.

1:47:43And if you And the thing is is in this the reason I stared at you the other moment a few minutes ago was that like you're obviously very competent at a number of things. And so what's difficult is that it took time and a lot of repetitions and probably some failures or many failures in order for you to gain that competence. And then not expecting that it will take other people those repetitions and failures in order to learn it um makes it very difficult for people to succeed. >> Mhm.

1:48:09>> You're very generous with your heart. Even though you're not emotional you're very emotionally intelligent. You know what I mean? Like >> Really is. >> No, oh yeah. >> I I find myself to be very emotionally intel- intelligent, but listening to you, I'm like, "Oof." >> [snorts] >> Maybe I'm not. >> [laughter] >> I take a little step back and cuz I had somebody I love look at me and they're like, "I don't think you're emotionally intelligent." And I was like, "Me?" And then like day by day I always come up to her and I go, "I think I'm starting to notice a little bit."

1:48:38>> [laughter] >> Yeah, started to notice a little bit more and more and more as I grow up. And uh I think that's it's super humiliating. Dog, I don't know if you feel this, but I've made a career off of just sharing my mistakes and there's a there's a sense of freedom because I was like, "Okay, cool. Like you're not going to hold me accou- I'm like holding myself accountable." Like I'm dancing in front of God naked and I'm doing my thing. The thing that I feel the most shame of is repeatedly making that same mistake in front of the world. Do you ever do that?

1:49:08>> Yeah, of course. >> How like what do you do to like build yourself up knowing that you're just like human? Are you allowed to say that since you're AI or He just looks at me mirror you come on, you're almost human. It's fine. >> Um how do I how do I get over repeating the same mistake? >> Yeah, like for example, you like with your wife. We'll make it personal, not business. >> Yeah. >> I bet it wasn't the next time she was crying, you're like, "Come here. You're beautiful." You know what I mean? Like it took time for you to like get there.

1:49:37But you make those mistakes cuz you're trying to get the better outcome, but you fall short. How do you not beat yourself up over it? >> One of my friends says a a quote I like a lot. He says, "Champions have short memories." >> It's a bunch of goldfishes around you? >> Yeah. Really. It's like does me beating myself up increase or decrease the likelihood that I'm going to be able to succeed at this the next time this happens?

1:50:06>> You just move on. >> If it has no bearing, then who am I punishing myself for? But if it if me punishing myself increases the odds that I will behave next time, then there's a purpose for it. I do think there's a purpose for guilt. I think there's a purpose for shame. It changes behavior. It's a very strong emotion. Like if if everyone in a group is behaving one way and they shame you, it's very pro-survival to act the way the group does.

1:50:30So it makes sense that we would feel very affected by that um to conform because it's more likely that we will survive in a group than we will on our own. >> If you could be vulnerable, what would something that that's like you don't feel like you're really talking about it too much, but that you're dealing with right now? >> [sighs] >> What am I dealing with now? Um I think there is a cost to being in the public eye.

1:50:58Obviously, I'm sure you're aware of it. Um and I think we alluded to it earlier like changing your behavior in any way is something that I'll I'll this. I think I struggle like anyone else um to And so if you're authentic, it means you have no fear of punishment, which means you're always the same in all settings. And I think that my life goal is to die with no secrets.

1:51:28It's to die completely laid bare. Um And I think that shame exists only in darkness and never in the light. It always shrinks in the light when people are aware of it. And so um I mean you you described me as an honest man. I I I hope that at the end of my life I'm described that way. And I I aspire for that title.

1:51:57Um I'm sure there are things that I could do better. And I I think about it like the whole truth. Like you can state It's kind of like three levels of truth. It's like how how true is something? Like I did this because of X, but also Y and really Z. Now from a from a worldview perspective, I pay attention to zero of that and only pay attention to behavior because it massively simplifies the world and dramatically increases your ability to predict people's behavior.

1:52:29But from an internal feeling perspective, um I feel best when I am call it my authentic self. And I think that the more I can merge reality with the public perception, but I think the struggle that I have there So this is finally me finding the words for this. Is that I try to demand complete understanding from a world that will give me none.

1:53:00And so like there will be clips that will be taken from this podcast that will be taken out of context. And I hate that. And I have to come to terms with it. And my way of thinking through it is like will I allow this to change my behavior? And as long as I continue to make that answer no, I'm living in that with that virtue as I see it. But it does not negate the emotional discomfort that comes with it.

1:53:29And so one of the things Layla and I are talking about right now, so you ask like what are you what are you dealing with right now, which is acting despite acting as if, how can I continue in a path and living with emotional discomfort knowing that there is nothing wrong but that I will suffer and that is okay. And I do not need to change things. I don't need to like cuz there's parts of me that get tons of like called energy from something not going the way I want it to go, right? In whatever sense.

1:54:01And with that energy I want to turntables and change everything. But I have to acknowledge that I'm trying to change the external world in order to change how I'm feeling about something and none of those actions might actually get me any closer to what I want. And so it's basically sitting in the suffering and being okay with it. And I'll say that is that is the muscle that I'm trying to work right now.

1:54:27>> That's deep. Long suffering. >> Mhm. >> A lot of leaders take that role. I hate to bring this up. >> It is a fruit of the spirit. I'm just >> [laughter] >> I'm just saying. >> the gospel, man. You know the gospel. I got to tie this back to this. The reason why there's so much on your plate, bro, that I look at and I'm like, my goodness, bro. Like if I could just take half of that, my life would be so much different. And I I there's a lot of things that I live by that I think would solve a lot of your things and I'll just to make it short, I say this at the bell all the time cuz I'll weep about this, bro. Like I had this thing with the Eucharist.

1:55:13Uh I said something um in the the body and blood of Christ. I said something describing it in the word of creation and I used the wrong word. And the whole world, bro, like but they had no idea my whole life >> Yeah. >> I would sit on my hands and knees accepting the the Eucharist and and so I turned to Bell and I said, "I dance naked in front of God alone."

1:55:38Which means one day I know that he will reveal all the things that like crush my heart. Like splitting up with a friend knowing that they really don't understand why we're splitting up and they're >> Totally. It's a It's a perfect example of like I'm getting kicked in the nuts problems where there is no action to be taken. Can I give one little story about this and I I want to loop in? So, I imagine I'll have a child soon, hopefully. >> God willing.

1:56:04>> When that happens, um the perfect analogy I have is let's say I have a a a Babe Ruth rookie card that's worth, you know, a million dollars. And somehow the kid gets into the drawer and tears it up and writes, you know, crayons on it. It's a 1-year-old or 2-years-old. What do you do in that moment? >> Abortion. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. You're asking a comic. I'm so sorry. >> Dude, you're good. I'm so sorry. >> I'm just I'm I'm so sorry. That was rude.

1:56:31>> You're fine. >> Plan B. >> I literally exclusively consume stand-up and gym equipment. That is my entire newsfeed. So, you're totally good. Um but in that moment there's nothing you can do. You're not going to teach a 2-year-old about the intrinsic value of a Babe Ruth card. Right? Or maybe a 1-year-old. Use whatever age understanding personal property would not really be a real thing. >> Yeah. >> So, those are just pure suffering problems. There's nothing that like there's nothing to do. You just have to suffer.

1:57:00>> Yeah. >> And so it's those those moments where you want to turn tables, you want to scream, you want to hit, you want to do whatever your your emotional outbreak is going to be, and just thinking like I will suffer and it will be fine. >> Can I say something that's going to piss you off? >> Go for it. >> You've met a lot of Christians that say they're Christians and they don't act like Christians. Yeah, you're the first person I ever met that denounced himself as a Christian. >> [laughter]

1:57:24>> And acts more like a Christian than any of my friends that I know that are at So honestly, bro, like I don't care. I'm going to start telling people you are Christian. I'm like, "Yeah, my Christian friend are you talking about?" Yeah, of course, bro. Yeah, he's one of my biggest biggest Christian friends. >> Yeah. >> You you have a Like I said, bro, like you're everything that you sit in and your morals and the way you attack life is is it's inspiring to me, dude. And I read the gospel. I'm literally I'm watching it pop out the page. I'm like, "I'm going to get this one day. I'm going [laughter] to get this one day." And you're I bro, imagine if you were a disciple. You'd be like, "John, thinking about it too much. Take the moment, John."

1:58:04>> [laughter] >> Uh but, dude, like yeah, I agree, man. I agree with everything you're saying and I think but also isn't there some sort of peace knowing that you could hold that type of like suffering [snorts] and still love? Does that not reflect the crucifixion of Jesus Christ? >> Like [laughter] does it not >> a >> It's such a tie back, but >> Yeah, well, it's just like the first part of the question I could say yes.

1:58:32>> Think about this. The worst thing in history to ever exist is the crucifixion of Jesus Christ. And at the same time, it is the greatest thing in the world is the crucifixion of Jesus Christ. Our God doesn't take a bad thing and a good thing and try to mix them. He turns something that's hurtful and then produces life out of it. It's kind of like Lazarus. He raised the dead up. And so the way that you're speaking just resonates so much of all these Christian values that I try to apply in my life, but you're just actively applying them in your life because it makes sense to you and it works and you get something out of it. It's producing things.

1:59:11>> I love Christianity. >> Yeah. >> I have no like >> No, I was just I'm just reminding you because you say you're you're not Christian. >> Um my and it's because I have such respect for the faith that I don't call myself a Christian because I would not say that I with 100% conviction could say could say I believe that God became man, lived a perfect life, and died for our sins, and then rose to heaven. >> Is 95% good enough? >> You're on that Dr. Jordan Peterson cusp.

1:59:36>> [laughter] >> Dude, it's it's honestly astonishing to see it, bro. It's You know what I I I tell people I tell people this. When I meet people like you, geniuses, and I will consider you a genius. And you don't have to crown yourself that, but I do see yourself as a genius. Geniuses wrestle with their own wisdom to the point where they separate themselves from God because of their own logic, because of the way they weigh things out, and it makes sense. Like dude, everything that you're saying to me, I'm not looking at it like pish posh. >> [laughter]

2:00:01>> This doesn't make sense. It makes sense. Everything that you're saying makes sense to me. It makes sense. >> Cuz it takes blind faith. In a way. Like to believe is to like believe blind, you know? And I think like for me what I was I was going to say in the beginning was that I really really believe that the faith that I have was a gift. >> Mhm. >> And I think that God gives us faith to believe, you know? And so when you ask him, and I'm sure you've done it a million times when you were, you know, pursuing him, was to like ask him for that faith, you know?

2:00:30And I know I asked him, I pleaded with him, and I asked him, and I chased him, and he put obstacles in my way, and I was like, "What is this? This is not getting any easier, you know?" But then I learned from them, and then and then yeah, and then sometimes it just leads you to that one little like lasting answer that might like flip the switch, you know? For me it was realizing I didn't have forgiveness in my life. And when I realized that I need to forgive a certain person in my life, then God opened my eyes. Like instantaneously, you know? >> Who do you forgive?

2:00:57>> But No, I mean it's the >> Oh, I believe you're holding a grudge on >> But you know >> I don't think I'm holding a grudge. >> I'm joking. >> [laughter] >> That was a fun joke. >> But yeah, she's absolutely right. It's like describing color to a colorblind man. He could see it, but he can't feel it. Do you get what I'm saying? Was that wrong? >> No, I'm just a colorblind man. >> You are? [laughter] >> No, no. >> Oh, I thought you really were. >> [laughter] >> I I delete this part of the podcast. That's fine. We had 3 hours. That's fine.

2:01:24>> [laughter] >> Just all the time. Uh, how did you feel? Did you feel like I was pushing too much faith here in this conversation or do you feel like >> I think I invited it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> You did invite it. >> No, I'm like I enjoy talking about the topic. I I'm willing to talk about the topic despite the negative ramifications that will happen because I think they'll be more positive than negative, but there will be negative. And that's kind of like the the example you gave, obviously not the same as the crucifixion, obviously. But I'm saying that there there will be good and bad and as long as I like Fame is a a simple a simple example of this, which is like fame has pros and cons.

2:02:04>> Yeah. >> There are more pros than cons, which is why you continue to do it. Um, but there are cons. It's an end. It's not is it good or bad? It's like there's both. There are costs. And I would imagine like we don't have children yet, but you know, when and if we have children Um there will be there will be pros and there will be cons. Like there will be trade-offs. Um, and so as long as the trades are trades we're willing to make Um then we were doing at least some degree of our own volition.

2:02:31>> Yeah. >> But no, I do not think you were overly uh preachy at least. I did not gauge your intent as malicious. >> Is that because you don't ever gauge people's intent? >> Uh I would say that I still gauge someone's intent in terms of do I think they are trying to make my life better? >> Mhm. >> And then if that's true, then I can instruct them in ways to actually make my life better and change their behavior. If their goal is to make my life worse, then I hope that they are incompetent and in so doing make my life better.

2:03:05Which happens surprisingly often. >> Does it ever hurt your heart watching somebody trying to do something bad to you, but then actually produces good fruit to you? >> Um >> Does it make you look at them differently? Like you cuz I'm assuming you've worked with people that you know that they don't have good intentions with you, but you let it slide cuz it's producing fruit for everybody. >> If someone were competent >> Yeah. >> and had malicious intentions, do I think that they would be successful in trying to hurt me? Well, yeah.

2:03:33>> Not even a successful. I'm just saying the fact that you're watching this cuz you have more wisdom than the person at the table. So, you're watching them trying to hurt you, but they're not succeeding. But in their mind, they think that they're getting one over you, but in reality, you're watching it all play out. That doesn't bother you that they they you in your mind know that they think they're getting one over you. >> weird sense of satisfaction, actually. >> But you understood what I was saying here? >> No, I totally understand what you're saying. Cuz it >> Thank god, it took so long to get that out of my head. >> Does it Does it hurt me that someone wants to hurt me?

2:04:01>> Yes. >> I think it's unfortunate, but I see that as again what I what I said earlier like trying to demand absolute understanding from a world that will give none. Like in a world of 60-second memes and clips, to expect people to have complete context on me and my life is ridiculous. And who am I to think that I deserve that? And I'm putting myself on this pedestal that I should be everyone's Everyone should have complete context over me, should have total understanding of all of the points and why I It's like it's ridiculous. Of course not.

2:04:33>> No, why do I have to read all of Proverbs to start behaving that way? And this guy goes, "I don't believe in it, but this is I actually What's going on here, dude? >> [laughter] >> What's going I'm going to go to heaven, and he's going to be like a George Mouffe. Alex, come on in, buddy." Like, dude, tell him about me, dude. >> When I realized that, I think um I'll call it the them, the public. Um I'm sure you've had some when you said you did the U Christmas up or whatever. >> Yeah. >> I realized that there's a certain percentage of the population that there's absolutely mentally unwell. And it's, you know, call it 1%, call it 5%. If you have a million people who follow you, 1% is a lot of people.

2:05:10Right? And all of them actively being like, you are the terrible and all these things because you remind them. They pattern recognize you from somebody else in their life that might have behaved similarly, looked similarly, talked similarly, whatever it is, right? And so, like for me, if I wear a wife beater, uh and I am muscular, and I look this way, I will remind some people of someone else that probably wasn't very nice. And it makes sense that their first reaction would be that way.

2:05:38And so, do I hold it against them? I don't know. But what I've noticed is that whatever point you can make, so if I said, "I think men in general should probably work harder than they are," the natural reaction will be, "So, you think everyone should become a slave to work, and money should be their god?" If I say, "Hey, I think that it's worth, you know, taking time and enjoying the fruits of life." It's like, "Are you trying to make the young men soft?" I think Taylor Swift had this uh acceptance speech where she talked about like her life through the albums that she made. I'm loosely paraphrasing. But she was like, "Okay, so I'm, you know, I'm I'm [ __ ] And so, because I'm dating all these guys." And so, then I stopped dating men, and now I'm now I'm a hermit, and I'm a grown-up. And And so, she basically just shows how whatever she does, the opposite becomes the narrative. And so, it just makes sense that

2:06:30>> or anyone as potentially an extreme permutation of whatever value and so they just naturally react as the equal opposite which is functionally just making a straw man argument. But straw men are not real and so understanding that they are attacking an idea that I agree with. As in like you should attack that idea. I also agree with you. That's not what I was saying but I agree with you.

2:06:56And so um I think that has helped and then the other one is is actually asking myself what if they're right. So I think we expend a huge amount of effort and let's say we receive public criticism for something and thinking like and we resist it. We're like I'm not that way. That's not true cuz for sure there are things that are just completely ridiculous but there are times where like people will give you feedback and you're like [ __ ] like I think what if they're right?

2:07:23And I think sometimes just like the open acceptance of like you know what? I can see why they would say that. I do come across kind of arrogant or whatever. >> Yeah. >> Uh or on that podcast I was a little short or maybe I was a little robotic or whatever. >> Yeah. >> And and but like there's so much release if you will from like the emotional pressure of trying to fight all of these comments or things like that versus being like >> I didn't even notice it from that point. >> Yeah.

2:07:48>> You're you're Oh wow, that's such a good way to deal with it without even really dealing with it. You're not angry and it's it's coming from a humble heart. It could be true. I'll I'll I'll review it and I'll get back to it. >> That might be true. >> Do you do you get have like I know this sounds really stupid but do comments affect you at this point? >> I would say I think they affect everyone who reads them.

2:08:15>> [laughter] >> That's so funny. So do you read them now or >> read a lot. No. I do not read a lot. >> Do you think that affects your work? >> No and so that's actually it's a really it's a it's a really interesting point. I know we're going off in all sorts of directions, but um >> Welcome to the George Nagao Show, Brian. Okay. My ADD comes alive through the screen. >> From from a content perspective, I actually think that there's a sweet spot of quote listening to the audience where like you need to not be tone deaf in terms of like giving people what they want, but at the same time um managing what you want. And so uh Toky is a friend of mine says you know, there's soulless corporations, there's starving artists, and I think the magic is in the middle. It's in the like it's it's these dichotomies where it's like they have to be managed not solved.

2:09:04You have to have like you have to walk the middle path, which is like I have to do things that feed me, and I have to do things that feed the audience. And so I I tend to make better stuff when I just purely make it for me, but if I do that, I don't make enough stuff. Um and so it's that it's that balance between those things. Um I'd say by and large if I stick to the things that I know, and I state the facts and tell the truth, which is the number one rule that we have in the marketing here, um then I feel very confident about what we put out as long as we put out nothing that appears in a way that gives an impression. So, we will like you'll know like if you ever consume our stuff, it's like if we ever if I ever say something to maybe be more persuasive, the goal is to state facts and then allow the facts to do the work.

2:09:44And if we don't have the facts, we need to go make the facts true. Like what what would be the craziest thing that if if this were true, everyone would want to buy this? Okay, then let's make that true. We make it true, then they will buy. And that could be buying into an idea, it could be buying into a product, it could be buying into a person, doesn't matter. >> This is freaking like

2:10:11>> Let's like I mean >> It's really [clears throat] so much that I want to >> [laughter] >> I want to like dive into my own personal like business, but I can't do that. People are going to be like, "Dude, no one cares. Don't do that." Okay, well, I'm going to end this with one final question. >> We've gone through a lot. [laughter] >> Really? I feel like just scratched the surface. >> I've And by the way, I could sit here for another 8 hours. I I love sitting with people that have my mind racing, and dog minds like My my my brain's actually exhausted right now, but it was it was racing. How do you How does a man kill his ego?

2:10:41>> I'll tell you if I do it. >> [laughter] >> No, I don't think I mean I So, maybe translating that into how do So, it's like First, I'm thinking, okay, what does that mean? The three questions. What does that mean? How do I know that? Why does it matter? Right? But, just starting at what does it mean, it's like would we would we say ego is just simply putting yourself above others?

2:11:13Because I think humility I think Chris uh, what's his name? Christiansen? Something Christiansen. Uh. Uh, starts with a K. End of America. Something Christiansen. Um, said this. He's a Harvard Business Professor. And he said, um, "Humility isn't decreasing your regard for oneself, but increasing your regard for others." And I really like that is because there's there's false humility. Oh, stop. You know, like there's that. Um, but I think the true killing of the ego happens less from you trying to make yourself less important, and more trying to make everyone else more important. I think that's more actionable and more useful.

2:11:50>> That's good. >> I like that. Bringing people up. >> Yeah. It's like how do you bring as many people up as you possibly can? And I see So, Socrates said this, but um, basically the only evil is ignorance. Now, again Now, you there's true knowledge. There's actually some parallels there that make sense, but um if we see ignorance as true evil, like that person only acted that way because they didn't know. >> Mhm. >> They didn't live the life that I've lived. They didn't know like they know not what they do, right?

2:12:19Evil, but >> I mean, dude, think about how many people would actually commit evil if they really knew. >> Right. If you had complete understanding. >> think people do evil things out of evil intentions. Right. I think a lot of people do bad things thinking it's good. Your mom calling and ratting you out. >> Which is why the again the intention thing I erase more or less in terms of my own life, but from my ego perspective back to the point. Um if our goal is to quote kill the ego, it means that we like the ultimate good would be that everyone has all knowledge.

2:12:49Cuz if everyone share has shares the exact same context exact same understanding and maybe that's what heaven is everyone knows everything. Um has the same shared context and so there's complete understanding. There's no miscommunications ever. Everyone shares the same values and there wouldn't be conflict. >> Yeah. >> Um but we don't live in that world. Uh but I would say that uh in an effort to kill the ego, it's how can you bring as many people up as possible into their levels of awareness um so they know more. >> It's good.

2:13:15>> Having grace. It's a lot of grace. >> Sounds more eloquent than it probably is in practice for me. I I definitely >> No, I learned a lot here today. I would love to do another episode where we could have like the couples. Like I would love to hear from your wife. >> Oh, Layla's a joke. >> If she if she would want to. >> Layla's a joke. >> She watches the podcast she goes, "I'm okay." >> [laughter] >> Hard pass. >> I'm fine. >> No, I think you would you'd find Layla just as if not more interesting.

2:13:42>> That'd be great. >> She's a joke. >> She's even more of a >> product of this >> [laughter] >> Doesn't she think these are perfect human beings, dude? >> No, Layla's >> They don't need Jesus. They're perfect. >> Please don't. >> [laughter] >> I don't know. Layla's real as [ __ ] Layla's real as [ __ ] Uh Layla Layla's Layla's the [ __ ] Layla's Layla's real people. Um >> Did you hear him? >> Yeah. Hm? Didn't you talk more? >> Yeah. He said a lot of stuff. Could you hear him? Cuz you were like you said the most meaningful thing on the podcast.

2:14:10You're like, "Layla." >> [laughter] >> No, it's >> She's good. >> Yeah. No, Layla's Layla's real people. Um she she has helped me become the man that I am. And she has overcome larger obstacles than I have. And witnessing her do that in that I have learned of her. >> Amen.

2:14:33Iron sharpens iron. It's dude, I Okay, I would love to ask you this because you have a lot of material things. Is it not a good wife the greatest gift ever? >> I'm pretty sure Solomon says that. >> If you If you trip the Bible at me one more time, >> [laughter] >> dog, I'm going to throw you in a pool and baptize you right now, dude. Uh >> No, 100%. I mean, because to be fair >> By the way, he did. He did He got that right.

2:15:01>> [laughter] >> It's like every time he says it, he says it right, too. But yeah, you're right. >> No, Layla but Layla also believed in me before I had anything. And so, I think that is why it's the gift. >> I didn't get to hear your story from your mouth, but yesterday last night 2:00, 3:00 in the morning? >> Probably. >> I'm sitting with my buddy, and I was like, "So, what's your favorite part? Like, tell me like what hit your heart the most." And dude, he reenacted you and your wife cuz he's an actor. And he's like He was sitting there, and he's like, "Leave me. This business is not doing well." And she's like, "If you're under the bridge, I'm sleeping under the bridge." And his eyes started getting glistening. I was like, "Dude, do you want to do this podcast?"

2:15:43>> [laughter] >> It's like seems like you really want it. That story you told seriously impacted him. Like, it it impacted his heart. Could you break this story down for me like in a way it's coming from your mouth? >> Yeah. Um >> Thank you. >> Better. You're good. You're good. >> Um So I asked So, I met Layla, she had a successful business, she was a personal trainer, she had a book of clients, she was doing fine. I at the time had I think four or five gyms, I can't remember. And I kept telling her like, let me just leapfrog you. Like I know where you're trying to go, like I'm I'm further ahead, I'm older than Layla is, and uh like I'll just I'll just take you with me.

2:16:24And so she kind of kept saying no in the beginning, she's like, I just met you, blah blah blah, and then I eventually got her to literally just destroy her business and then join me. Um and then the new business that I did after she gave up her business um failed. And so I put all the money of taking my gyms, sold them all, put all the cash into the new business, and that business failed. And she left everything for that. And so then I had to go meet her parents uh at this moment, where we're now living at her parents' house.

2:16:57Sick. Um Yeah. I'm the the guy she met on the internet. Um and so >> Yeah. Yeah. That that that convinced her to leave her job {slash} you know, her income, and then galavant across the country launching gyms out of motels. Um and no, we had one motel room cuz uh we did not have money for two hotel rooms.

2:17:20Um and so her parents were not thrilled about me. And so I'm coming the opposite of the triumphant hero, coming coming back. And um when the first I've lost everything two times. The first time is this time. Um I put all that money into the this new business, and the long story short is that um the money the partner that I had at the time ended up draining the bank account, and then I confronted him, he said that I was stealing, and I was like, well, let's see like So then I took the cuz I had a mentor, and he was like, just take the financials, go line by line, and then show him, like, it's fine. Like, just figure it out. So I went there having highlighted everything to be like, hey, let's just go over through this line by line." And then he like dusted it off the table. He was like, "I don't need to see that shit." I was like, "Oh, I got robbed. Holy cow. This is totally not what I I didn't think this happened." Um and so and that was after selling all my gyms. So, like it was the money that I had that I put there and then got trained. And so, um then uh Leila went to launch a gym on her own uh because that was the only business that was working. This is after I have the hard conversation. She's like, "Hey, what if we did that one thing that worked?" Um I also got a DUI, head-on collision, running around this time, too. Winner. Uh my mom's in the hospital at the time.

2:18:38Um and so, I'm very stressed. And so, all of this is in 90 days. So, I lose all the money I have, I get a DUI, my mom's in in in the hospital. Um and yeah, that's that was my situation. And so, >> that you wanted to look to add one more, I was like, "Dude, the [laughter] anxiety just counting down." I'm just going through finger by finger. I was like, "Dude, enough." >> So, I So, obviously at this point I have have uh nothing. And she also asked six of her best friends from high school to quit their jobs to start this business to do this new launching business with me. And so, she then does this launch, crushes it. I also break up with her before she goes and does this launch. Um and so, she still goes and still crushes it. She actually asked me, she's like, "Do you still want to be with me?" And I was like, "I don't I like I was like, "I don't even have Man, I can't even comprehend a relationship right now." Um and she was like, "Got it." And so, we still talked every day, but like we had officially quote broken up. Um but she went there and honestly a big part of what made me see Leila's strength was that she could have 100% been like, "Screw this guy, uh this winner that I just picked up from jail um for a DUI after quitting everything and all of that." And then she goes and does this launch and sets the all-time record. She just crushes it.

2:20:03And all of that money went to paying back the refunds from the gym that all the money got stolen out of. So, I'm still at zero. But, it was it was what allowed me to be at zero. I would have been negative. >> So, wait. I'm so sorry. So, you kicked her to the curb. >> Yes. >> And with her stack of money >> No, no. It wasn't her I mean she made money for the business. She had a commission because she was a sales rep that I technically hired. And so, you know, we had an agreement for what she would get paid. There was excess.

2:20:32All of the excess is what I was able to take to put towards this business that was now leaking money. >> Got it. Got it. >> Cuz the cuz the money that would have been there to capitalize the business was gone. >> Got it. >> So, that is now zero, but I was able to basically successfully close that business because the partner that was supposed to be my partner walked away with the money. I was like, I don't want to like the agreement that he and I had was that he was going to run the gym. He didn't run the gym. And that's now I'm stuck with all these clients there's no cash in the account. >> Mhm. >> Can't pay payroll, etc.

2:20:55So, that's that's the situation. A few weeks later, we're supposed to launch six gyms. This is one. We're supposed to launch six gyms. And the cash that we're supposed to make from the sale and the cash that we're supposed to make from the launch was supposed to then capitalize this new business with six locations launching. I had zero. I had a thousand. And so, I'm now flying to her parents' house because it's Christmas time. Um

2:21:20>> Are you guys back together now? >> Yeah, so she comes back and we make up. >> fizzled out the romance, [laughter] bro. You're skipping past that. How did you guys rekindle the romance? >> I honestly can't remember. >> It So, it wasn't really fizzled out to >> I mean, we talked every day. And then I think when she came back, I was like, "Would you like to get back together?" And I think she was like, "Yes." I was like, "Okay, great." We have all this stuff that we have to do.

2:21:46>> [laughter] >> All right. Let's get to work. >> Yeah. Um but uh so, when she came back, we got back together. I took the cash, paid off the basically the debts that that business owed, and then we had to uh, launch the next six gyms that all of our friends quit their jobs for. And so we fly back to her hometown because it's Christmas time, and we stay at her parents' house. Um, and I have to turn on ads for six locations. I've got hotels, airfare, rental car, ad spend. It's about $3,300 a day.

2:22:20I have $1,000 total that's going out. And basically right before I do that, I sit down with her and I'm like, "Okay. So, you know that business idea that you left everything for, um, this is probably going to go horribly wrong. And it's very unlikely that this will succeed. I have the I still had an MX card that still had my old limit from all the gyms that I had. So, MX hadn't updated my limit cuz I had no money.

2:22:52They weren't aware of that. Um, and so I still had around like $100,000 limit cuz I had multiple locations that I could put on this card. And so I was like, "I'm going to put the whole thing on this card, and it really might not work out. And so I would be totally okay, and I would respect you if you wanted to leave right now. Like it's it's understandable. Like and we will be good. And we I'll honor our agreement. We can still do the launches and get paid, all that stuff.

2:23:19Um, and that was when she looked at me and grabbed my chin and she was like, "I would sleep with you under a bridge if it came to that." >> That's true love. She really loved you. >> Yeah. If she were here, she'd be like, "I was just out of [ __ ] options, you know?" >> Yeah, [laughter] all right. >> Dude, what a beautiful story, man. >> story. >> Dude, awesome, bro. That I pray that you guys have soon-to-be a child, but I pray that you guys have a blessed family. >> For sure.

2:23:44>> And I'll be on your door every day. Hey, is it today? Did you find Jesus? >> Yeah. Got the good news. Do you want to hear >> Got the good news, bro. Uh But dude, that was a that was an incredible story, man. Now I understand why he was like Well, he was so into it. I was like, bro, I'm into it now. >> That was a 5-minute story. The It's honestly 10 times worse and 20 times longer. It's insane. The story is nuts. >> I'm sure it's nuts.

2:24:09>> It's nuts. Like I told you about the first time I lost the money. Not this The not the next time. >> right. This is only the one >> Yeah. >> Yeah, like it it's it's insane. It's truly insane. >> guys feel like the >> Am I allowed to hear the next time or is this like a >> No, it's it's I don't I don't want to bore the audience. Uh but yeah. >> There's not 1 minute I've been bored so far. >> You guys really have like an inseparable bond. Like the things that you guys have been through have built this this strength between you guys at this point, right?

2:24:35>> She and I have built a lot of loyalty and mutual understanding. And I think that in some ways it's a like you think I think what is some of a business term, but like like you want like moats for a relationship. Like what are the things that are like irreplaceable? >> What do you moats? >> Yeah, like competitive moat in a business, something that other people can't like assail. Like if you had a moat in a castle, it's hard for somebody to attack it. >> Are you lost? >> I don't know what a moat is, but I can understand what you mean.

2:25:03>> I know exactly what you mean. >> Yeah. Yeah, that's true. >> [laughter] >> So So it's like Layla Layla has this quippy quote where she says, "There's always reasons to leave a relationship. You just have to have more reasons to stay." >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> And so um I think that this is one of those like reasons to stay, which is that we will never be able to be who we were then and be with someone else.

2:25:29>> Mhm. >> Because no one It would be unlikely that someone would be able to meet me but what's impossible for someone to meet me without the track record that I have right now. Even if I lost it all, I'm still me. >> Yeah. >> have the story. I still have like I still have that. Um and the same thing for her. And so like no one will ever be able to be with me on the come up. No one will ever be able to have blind faith in me like she did. >> Yeah. >> And so I think >> Yeah.

2:25:53>> And I think that's what I think like this is a a message to women which I'm barely able to make obviously being >> Yeah, and watch yourself by the way. >> Yeah. >> Tread lightly. >> If you want to get undying loyalty from a man, believe in him. Like and he will move the world. >> That's a fact. >> I think the I think a lot of times the potential of a man is is directly proportional to what his wife thinks that he can achieve.

2:26:25>> Totally. Man. >> Dude, I can't even tell you. I I I tell people all the time I would not be who I am if God didn't bless me with Val. Like not just pouring love into me and believing in me, but giving me a reason to get back up. I think that if I didn't meet her and you know you said something that sparked something in me. You said she's gone through way more.

2:26:51>> Oh. >> Bro, how blessed are we, bro? Cuz I have the same measurement here. Like when I hear her about what she goes through or what I went through, I'm like oh, I got to stop complaining. Like this is like she has a reason to complain, but she never complains. She never complains. Always the most positive, always the most bright. And uh having a woman I I tell I tell this and I I do give advice to women and I do it all the time and I don't care.

2:27:18>> [laughter] >> And you better listen. A woman is either an anchor or wings. They're never in the middle, man. It's either that girl is bringing you down and down hard, bro. Or she's giving you wings and you're flying at levels you've never flown before. He loves your wings. >> Mhm? >> I said choose your wings. >> Oh, yeah. >> With no trees. It's Layla, right? >> It was cute. Yeah. >> I thought I called her name wrong.

2:27:44>> No, no, no. >> He said what? And I was like, oh my god, oh my god. >> [laughter] >> I >> I made a mistake. That's so funny. >> No, you're good. >> Dude, thank you so much. And I know we've wrapped this up before, but I I do appreciate >> Yeah, this is for real, but I >> Thank you so much. >> Thank you. Appreciate you. Yeah. >> so good. >> That's awesome.