Warum eine Kult Fangemeinde nicht das Ziel sein sollte

0:00I'm kind of a subject matter expert. Like people know me as the Tinder guy. And I'm somewhat of an expert. I'm somewhat [laughter] of an expert. That was the best brag. Humble brag here, but >> [laughter] >> Wasn't that humble? But in my opinion, like I have so much conviction in what I do. Like in the dating space, I think online dating is like the biggest cheat code for men on Earth. And a lot of my competitors, they might talk a little bit of [ __ ] about it or maybe they say like, "Oh yeah, I use a little online dating, a little day game, a little night game." In my opinion, everything else is a waste of time and this is like the most efficient date funnel. But my audience just knows me as the Tinder guy. Like if they need a dating tip for Tinder, they'll come to me for that. And it's very like surface level like information educational content. Which is good for a school community, it gets me to the school games. But I've seen some of the biggest creators and the biggest people in the education space aren't just subject matter experts. They're cult leaders.

0:59How do you build a cult-like following to get your audience to have as much as much conviction as you do? Like Alex, you have people dressing as you for Halloween. Yeah. How do I get that, bro? How do we get to that level? Is that true? Yeah. >> [laughter] >> There's a There's a lot. There's a lot. I think the the Halloween thing is as a separate comment is that um I wear the same thing. And so it actually like very it it'd be very difficult to dress as many creators cuz they don't just dress in a distinctive style. So no one would know.

1:30I've never seen you in jeans before, but this is >> a big It's huge huge change. Just I told Layla uh cuz I walked in jeans for the first time in a long time um into the office. And like all the ladies were like, "Alex, you should keep wearing jeans." And uh I was like, "You really want to get to the point where you've set the bar so low >> [laughter] >> that they're like, "He's wearing jeans. Look at this guy." And I was like, "Well, you know, you know, I showered yesterday." First party done it. Yeah, first party done it, exactly.

2:00Um But also you recently changed something a little bit about your what you're doing too. I noticed that one of the easiest ways when I'm trying to change is to change something like my hair or what I wear or whatever. Or your routine. Mhm. Um but that's also I've noticed very good to keep it somewhat consistent because people pick up on that stuff. Um about the cult thing.

2:27Um Hm, I think if you just repeat the same thing a lot and you stick to it, then people start to realize that this is the thing and this the whole like community forms around it basically and you're you have the same things you repeat again and again, right? Apple has like a cult kind of too.

2:53Um And this for example, like in schools schools we've got the cat, right? People like that. Some people get the school games tattoo. But it takes a long time of repeating the same thing and being very passionate about it and sticking to it for other people to like want to wear it too, if that makes sense. You need to demonstrate visibly that you control the things that they want to control.

3:19Number one. Number two is you need to be get give behavioral instructions that they can follow and get a good outcome. Number three, you need to have third-party credibility that the things you say are true. And number four, you need to be like them. Whatever your audience is. If you do those four things, you condition yourself as a reinforcer. And a reinforcer is just something that gets someone to do something again. And so that is fundamental like those are the steps.

3:46Okay. And so when we're thinking about content, it's like, okay, when we talk like make good [ __ ] right? We have to give instructions that yield good returns for people that are non-obvious. And if you remove all the friction that someone is encountering that's blocking them from the thing they want and then you help them get through that friction with your instructions, they will attribute a portion of that outcome to you. And with content you can do that at scale.

4:14And do you think that's the path to get to the point where as a creator you can make like an hour-long video on cut and people just watch the whole thing. You don't even need a call to action but they'll go down to the description and click it. Is it just doing more of that? As long So, content rule in general, no such thing as too long, only too boring. And so as long like Netflix has proven this, people will watch I mean people watch binge for hours and hours and hours. Like people will consume as long as it's rewarding.

4:42>> podcasts these days. Have you seen some of them? Yeah. >> I I put out I put out my team put out all my all my sales trainings as one thing recently. And it murdered. It's like nine It's a It's so long. And I put out one that was just all my like brutally honest ones together. And I had a friend of mine who's very successful and he was like, "Oh, I just listened to that." I was like, "Bro, it was eight and a half hours." And he was like, "I had a long trip."

5:08>> [laughter] >> I was like He was like it was just nice to have in the background. And so as long as as long as the the content is reinforcing for the audience which gets them to continue to consume it, they will. But I think a a lot of that though is that um you do get more leeway as you condition yourself as a reinforcer. Or people will start consuming it because of you because they have a long history of you having helped them. Rather than Like it starts with the content. That cuz you have no They don't When someone doesn't know who you are, the only thing you have to add value is the stuff in the video. Eventually you become a portion of the value that they've created through following your direction.

5:44Like Martha Stewart had a cult. Yeah. Why did she have a cult? It's like I've just studied her cuz I think she's really interesting. Um she literally gave recipes. She gave day after day she gave recipes that people followed and got a good outcome. And she would make lasagna and and the people who cared the most about that lady or guy if they knew a small person in the audience. Um they made lasagna her way and they're like, "Mom, this is great." And that mom, "This is great." a portion of that got credited to Martha.

6:13And you do that for a long period of time. There's a lot of men, "Martha's Martha's changed my life." And she has because you educated. She changed behavior. How much of an aspect do you think like going to war is in creating a cult-like following? Going to war? Yeah. So I've read a like a lot of like history books and things like that and it seems like some of the greatest people who had a cult-like following had an enemy and created an us versus them kind of dynamic. But you both have a cult following and to all the content I've seen, I haven't really seen you like go to war with anyone.

6:44Yeah. Like I I think that it's kind of bad advice. >> [laughter] >> Cuz I it's not good. It's kind of negative if you think about it, right? >> Yeah. And it it's putting a lot of focus on something else. Yeah. I think that if to translate the enemy portion into something that's maybe more palatable is that I think that an enemy of schools would be spending all day doing stuff you hate.

7:10Yeah. That would be the enemy for the movement of school which is like >> Fun is our thing and simplicity the so complexity and not fun is our enemy. But we're not pointing at a dude and being like, "That guy." >> [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah. But like to So I think you it doesn't have to be a person. Not at all. >> I think you can Or company. I think that's another mistake. >> [laughter] >> Yeah. I think >> It's like schools of thought that are different, right? Or something like that. Yeah. I'm for not victimhood.

7:37I'm for being willing to do more than your competition. >> And I'm also not trying to start a cult, either. Like, I don't think Steve Jobs was, either. He was just trying to make the best computer in the world. >> [laughter] >> To be clear. Just kind of habit. Well, Steve Jobs wanted to make the best computer in the world. And part of that was not having to think about what clothes he was wearing, which is how the jeans in the You're kind of getting there. >> I know. >> [laughter]

8:03>> And the turtleneck, it was it wasn't he was trying to have that as a style. It was just he didn't care. And it was the computer that was the main thing. And that's why I wear the same shirt. One, cuz it's comfortable, and two, I don't have to think about it. So, I can make the best platform, right? You're probably the same. It's not actually trying to create a a character or anything, but it it works because it's so consistent, I think.

8:30>> is a big part of it. Okay. Yeah, I wouldn't like you don't want a cult. You want people who you have provided value to, who believe that you will provide value to them in the future, and as a result, they adhere to your suggestions. And like go to bat for me, too. Like, I want to be so valuable to people and make such an impact that like if people are talking crap in the comments, they come to bat and be like, "No, Hunter's the guy, bro. He knows what he's talking about." Like, that's that's really the the reason behind my question. Not like I'm some narcissist wanting to create some cult and go down to an an island

9:04>> [laughter] >> My goodness. More more more good [ __ ] that helps people do the stuff they want. There's a lot of negative stuff in how you view it. I can tell by the language. Like, even the the reason you want a cult is just so that they can go to war for you in the comments. Yeah, I agree. I agree. You got to think about it in a different way, I think. Like, you should want to make the best thing, basically. And if you do that, a community will form around it, and they will be super passionate, and they will want to help.

9:34>> Elon hasn't tried to build a cult. But like Tesla and his products have a cult-like following. Yeah, and it's it's not it's just his commitment to the the thing. I wouldn't I wouldn't I don't think I would have the brand I have without the books. I think the books people could use them and then they change their life and then they're like, "Holy [ __ ] this is great." But, like it's the the core part is like what percentage of people's lives can I actually impact? And if you make that the true North Star and it really is the North Star, I think people can I think people can tell who who Have you guys read my books? Yes. Okay.

10:13Um like, you could hopefully tell that like I put a lot of time into trying to make it as simple as humanly possible cuz I really want people to win for whatever reason. Um and so, like I think that's the care that people could like the engineer who like just they can tell that he just really wanted to make an amazing engine. And I think that you if you put the product with everything, everything else does take care of itself. It's just very hard cuz there's so many distractions. If you told me that you were buying these shoes, I would go buy those shoes. But, then if you told me you started swimming, I would start swimming. Because they like that person as a person, too. So, it's a level of There's one thing I saw back in the day called edutainment. Right?

10:48Education and entertainment. And so, you pair the two of those things together. And maybe the entertainment is that you're funny, too. Or that you're like a normal dude that picks up women that are out of your league or something, right? And then people can relate to that or see like the humanistic component that makes them have more of a deeper connection with you than just like yeah, I read the book that he put out or whatever it might be. >> Good advice generalizes. So, if I tell you how to do one thing very well and then I tell you like you've given me 10 dating tips or whatever if I tell you something about fashion it's a little bit to the left, but you're like, "Well, this this starts to generalize. So, I'll start believing here." You have two or three generalizations and eventually they just listen to your advice.

11:29Because other advice in general has worked. And so, that's when you become That's when you become a generically kind of quote influencer or interesting person. And then I just I just want to hit the the enemies thing in terms of the comments. It's never going to stop. It will only go up. And the more you believe in anything, the more you will have counter resistance to that thing no matter what. And so in the beginning it's like, "Oh my god, I have some hate." And then you'll have more and more hate until eventually like you become news.

12:00Like Elon or Trump make It doesn't matter what they do. They are viral. Like they are news. It doesn't like they don't have to do anything newsworthy. They are newsworthy. And that's where it gets to. And a lot of people don't want that to be clear. But like that's the eventuality. So I just wouldn't like hate is a part of it. Like even if something's amazing, like think about something like everyone comes out and says this this movie was amazing. There's like 10% of people who come out and be like, "No, it wasn't." And everybody's so upset and it's overrated and I think it's not as good. It's like It's just they can't. It's like cuz they want At some point you become in in disagreeing and that's how they create their difference and their uniqueness. Real quick, I'm going to show you the exact 10-stage roadmap from zero to 100 million plus that less than 1% of companies finish I've now done multiple times. And so I can say with a lot of confidence that these are the stages as headcount increases that you need to get through.

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