"Am I Burnt Out or Just Bored?"

0:00You see, we provide lead generation and SaaS solutions for life-affirming crisis pregnancy centers. Uh so, I know your book helped us create our grand slam offer. We four x since then, so huge thanks. >> Hell yeah, baby. >> It's helped us reach like thousands more mothers and a lot more babies to alive today because of that. So, congrats on your own baby, too. >> Thank you. >> We we generate uh 2 million per year uh plus 550 on the SaaS side. >> Okay. >> We want to get to 5 million in 2 years.

0:27>> Okay. >> Uh and we're growing consistently, but what's stopping me is that despite everything being healthy and the mission still mattering to me a lot, I have lost the motivation to do the work. So, I've been doing this almost 9 years. I turned 30 on the 18th. Um about a year ago, it started. I've been feeling increasingly jaded. I'm trying to determine whether I'm burnt out, bored, miscast in my role, or just genuinely ready to move on.

0:54>> I think So, so I I define burnout as the reward that you got for doing the work before either comes now at a greater delay or no longer satisfies the way it did, which means you need to change the variety or intensity of reward. All right? So, you do said in plain speak, uh you're not getting out of it what you used to for the same work. Does that sound right? >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, I'll give you two frames to think through this with.

1:21Number one is all businesses are the same when you succeed at a high enough level. Which is that if you play this out until it's at 10 million or whatever, you're probably going to have a director of marketing, director of sales, director of IT, a director of whatever. And you're just going to be managing the seven people and the widget or the product that you sell or the service that you sell, it doesn't really matter. I mean, it matters from a like big goal, mission, et cetera, and that's what you're doing, and that's already fine.

1:45But your actual day-to-day is not going to change that materially. The second frame that I would offer um is that I think that you You not thinking big enough. Like you seem like a uh a cogent person. Like you seem like you have relatively clear thinking. Um and so I think that you have higher potential than you have aspirations, at least stated just now.

2:12Uh there's nothing cuz when you said I'm at two, you know, whatever, two and a half, I think we get to five in the next 2 years. Like why not get to 10 in in in 12 months, right? Like why not why not think bigger? >> Yeah. >> Like what would it take? >> So it's tap our our TAM. We we are TAM size limited. I think there's, you know, we have about 20% or 15% of the market share. Um there's probably 800 pregnancy centers out there that would qualify for our program.

2:43>> Okay. >> And so unless we added like lots more products and services, >> Mhm. >> um you know, which we could do. >> Mhm. >> So I think part of the problem is like over the last 2 years, well, this isn't a problem. I delegated a lot. So my team's handling like all the day-to-day. >> Yeah. >> And um so I cleared that up my schedule so I could focus on the things that only the CEO could do. I watched your video on maker versus manager days. I carved out 2 days for just maker activities.

3:10>> Love it. >> Uh yeah, it's great video. Um but I've been doing that for about 2 months now and what I've ended up doing is just sitting at my desk and it just feels like there's this psychological barrier just keeping me from doing the work. And that work being like writing content, filling content. This is essentially the I went to the scaling workshop in January and they said, "Yeah, your your problem is you need to be more famous." So I launched the podcast. Yeah. >> Good. >> Um launched the podcast, it's going well. Um but, you know, I know I'm not a lazy person, but for some reason I feel very lazy when I get in the office. I just don't want to do it. And so my Christian CEO group said, "You need to take a 2-month sabbatical." But I know that that's not going to magically fix it either.

3:49>> It means the work itself is no longer rewarding. >> Mhm. And so to me, what creates reward? What creates reward for me is challenge. And I'm going to put a big one here is stakes. Like right now, you don't have high enough stakes. That's why I'm saying you're not thinking big enough. It's like Like here's my equivalent for you. You started Let's say you're at a blackjack table cuz I'm in Vegas, right?

4:14You're at a blackjack table and you have $10,000 saved up. If you're playing $100 hands, like you could lose your entire fortune in in a in a night in Vegas, right? If you're a billionaire and you're playing $100 hands, you make $100 faster than you can even play the hand. It becomes meaningless. And so when billionaires are at the casino, they have to bet with big enough zeros that it actually has real stakes for them. And so the thing is is like I think you've become successful enough that you must raise your stakes.

4:49It's like you have to make bigger bets. >> That resonates cuz we've been taking on about the same amount of clients like targeting 25 new ones for the last 2 years. We've saved up half a million in the bank and kind of figuring out how do we want to spend this to to grow. >> Yeah. >> Um you know, my So we're hiring like another That's why I didn't ask about In the past it would have been demand is my constraint, but I know you're just going to say do more.

5:14So we're hiring another center cuz we can get more proposals so we can get more business. >> Good. >> Um but you know, I I looked at you know, what do I love you know, one of the frameworks for burnout is like it's the wrong type of work. So if you're doing like menial stuff, you should have delegated that and you know, delegate that. So I realized you know, I love negotiating, pitching, communicating, those high-stakes conversations, but the ops, keeping organized, stuff like that, I dread. Is that realistic for me as a CEO to say

5:42>> 100%. >> How can I get to just doing that? >> Dude, you can do whatever the [ __ ] you want. >> Yeah. >> Dude, it's your business. You can do whatever the [ __ ] you want. There are no rules. It's a You like the You like the Offers book. The first line in that book is there are no rules. Toby from And this goes all the way up. Toby from Shopify, who's the founder, he just works on product. He's not even the CEO. That's all he likes doing. So, that's what he does.

6:10>> So, would that mean like trying to hire a COO level when you you know? Cuz I know you guys didn't do that till way later at your company. When do you know you're ready to just have an ops person to run it? >> It's just I would say this is that you don't want an ops person cuz ops people are rarely the people who can actually run [ __ ] What you want is a leader. And I would prefer you use that language cuz it'll be much more It'll be much closer to the person you actually need. Cuz like right now, people in your company look up to you in some way. They admire elements of who you are. And so, you need someone who people also admire that they will then go to to solve their day-to-day problems. So, it's basically like to me, the the best leaders are excellent decision-makers and excellent with people.

6:49And that's what makes somebody who's a quote good operator. And no good operators actually call themselves operators. >> Mhm. >> Just as a little tidbit I've learned from placing operators. They don't call themselves operators. >> So, it could be another visionary type as well. It doesn't have to be just more of a people manager person. >> No, I'm saying the A people manager, again, people manager sounds like a manager. I think you want a Call it a director and up. Cuz you you want somebody who the whole team looks up to and then can go to them rather than you so that you can go promote. It sounds like you like winning business.

7:20>> Mhm. I do. >> Right. So, it's like right now you're you're a hunter and you're in the farm. And so, you're like, "Dude, farming's boring." It's like, "Yeah, no shit." Especially if you're a hunter. >> Yeah. >> It's like, "Dude, you got to go hunt." Like, you got to go hunt not because the business needs it, but because you need it. >> Yeah, so larger deals. >> Yes. Why do you think I did the launch? The $100 million launch? I didn't like there's no like the business that I have makes a shitload of money, right? The portfolio that we have makes a shitload of money. I don't need to do a $100 million launch. I made up a goal cuz I thought it'd be sick.

7:54>> Yeah. >> Com- entirely made up. >> bigger deals. My deals right now are 3K a month and >> Yeah. >> Um I mean these are nonprofit crisis pregnancy centers, so it's I mean there's definitely a niche within a niche. I could find people who could spend more, but I don't know what to offer them because it feels like I'd be selling uh you know, vanity marketing services. Right now we're heavy on Google Ads SEO AEO cuz that's really where they get the leads from. That's where women go to find info. And so I could add all these other marketing things, but I don't have the conviction that it will help, so I'm not sure.

8:25>> That's fine. I would rather you just increase the goal of your sales velocity. So I'll tell you I'll tell you I'll I'll give you a little back back uh we call it back door baseball or something like that. Um there's a deal that I'm working on um I I I have to be very careful what I'm sharing. Um but we have goals for that company, right? And the goals that we have talked about with the you know, founders of the business have been okay, this is what we're going to do over the next five and seven years.

8:53As soon as we agreed on those numbers and we went back and forth cuz there's you know, there's work involved with both those things on both sides. As soon as I met up with uh my team internally, I was like, how the [ __ ] are we going to do this in 12 months? And I was like, and let's reverse the entire model to getting it done in 12 months. And so that's what we started at. Like what would it take? And so since it's my favorite question in the world, what do I want to happen? What would it take? And I think that if you look at what it would take, that will start to get you excited because the stakes will go up.

9:22Because right now you growing by 20% or 30% 2 years in a row just doesn't mean a lot to you. Cuz the thing is is it changes nothing about your life. So like for a goal to be meaningful, we have to think what happens after I accomplish this goal. For me, goals supposed meaningful is I translate the next level of what does it change about my life every day. If nothing changes about my life every day, then the goal has no value. And so if it has no value, then the work I'm doing must have value. Cuz otherwise, then I'm doing work I don't care about to get a goal that doesn't change anything about my life.

9:49That sucks. >> Yeah. That makes total sense. So last follow up on that cuz it naturally leads to >> is good, dude. This is a lot of people like you're not alone here. That's why I'm spending time on this one. Go for it. >> I appreciate you. Yeah. If I ramp up sales, >> Mhm. >> we quickly run into a fulfillment uh gap where we're we're constrained there because we're dealing with a hyper niche. I mean, there's literally like 20 people who know how to run ads >> Yeah.

10:15>> with our target avatar. So we could go out and find Google Ads people who are know how to do like just local small businesses and then train them on that stuff. >> Yeah. >> Um but it all comes at a time that's just it's very uncertain where like our cost per lead has almost doubled in the last year from like >> Yeah. >> inflation and AI and things like that. So we don't even know 5 years from now is Google, which we're heavily reliant on as a channel, if it's still going to be around. So what's your advice on scaling

10:44>> Don't worry about it. >> look at other channels? >> Don't worry about it. And I'll I'll I'll tell you why. Because that conversation has happened every single year since I've been in marketing. Because what you're saying is that marketing is changing. Marketing is literally always changing. Cuz attention changes. 10 years ago, people weren't starting YouTube channels. Things change. Right? And it's like now it's you know, like the thing is is the thing that you have to bet on is that you will figure it out.

11:13And the [clears throat] writing on the wall will be obvious. I think more entrepreneurs kill businesses out of anxiety and worry than reality does. >> Mhm. >> They're like, I have this good thing, but it's not going to last forever. No business lasts forever doing exactly what it does. The things you'll do in the business will change over time because the world changes. It makes sense. >> Yeah. >> So, said differently, if you have a certain set of customers that you understand very deeply, you understand their problems, you understand to help them, then the services that you offer them are basically limitless. It's just whatever you need to help that person that in exchange for money. Now, I'm not saying do everything for that person. I don't think that's necessarily the right business model. But like, you generating leads, like they're going to still need leads. Like that demand for them for having leads will not go away. And so then the question is just do you think you'll be able to figure it out when things change?

12:01>> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I do. I think we're in that transition right now cuz you're right. We've been anxious about it for 9 years. But this is the first year we actually see like CPLs significantly affected by AI. So, that's where it's like, oh, we're here now. >> Yeah. That And great. And you worried about it for 9 years for nothing. And now it's actually here. And now you can make the shift. And you're going to do it elegantly. You're going to say, "Hey, over time we're just putting 30% of your ad budget over here, 50% of your budget." And over time you're just going to elegantly switch over.

12:27No big deal. >> Yeah. >> Like it's like we have this fear that >> and AEO is the future for local spot businesses. So, like, lead gen or >> I think it's one of. I think there's a lot of pieces to it. But like, I don't want to get into the weeds because I don't think it matters to your decision-making process right now. Um >> Yeah. >> You just have to believe that you have the ability to solve this better than your customers. Do you feel like that's true? >> Yeah. >> Then yeah, dude. I wouldn't sweat it.

12:52Like I just think so, takeaways here. I think you need to raise the stakes. I need you to bet bigger. I think you need to shorten your timelines so that it they're meaningful. And I think you should get the [ __ ] off your plate that's farming and you get back to hunting and promoting. Like go close some business and I think you'll feel better about it because you'll actually be like making meaningful progress towards a goal that you now feel is more meaningful because it actually has a change and impact on your life. You growing 20 or 30% is not going to change the food you eat or where you live. If you grow by 300% it will.

13:22>> Yeah. Uh love it. >> Appreciate you, man. No, you bet. too. you like this video and you're a business owner who wants to break through your current revenue ceiling, I I distilled every lesson from scaling 10 businesses past 10 million and three businesses past 100 million into a completely free scaling roadmap that I've used to go from zero to one, zero to 10, and zero to 100 plus. And so, you can click here and you can check it out. Again, absolutely free. And since you're a business owner, appreciate you and uh enjoy.