You Get Nothing by Staying Where You Are

0:00Have you seen a change in the types of questions that you're being asked because because the world has changed, people are more interested in personal branding or business or whatever else? Are people asking you new questions? >> No, actually I don't think. >> What are the questions that you get asked? >> I get asked a lot of like hey, I'm thinking about doing this this thing, what do you think? I'm thinking about starting this kind of business. I'm thinking about starting a podcast agency, what do you think? And it doesn't matter what I think. >> [laughter]

0:25>> I'm like and so I'll just ask the next question which is like, well, what have you done so far? >> Why do you ask that? >> Well, because the answer nine times out of 10 is well, I mean, I haven't I was just thinking about it. I'm like, okay, well, then nothing's happened. >> What's going on there with those people that come up to you and they say they're thinking about something, but they haven't done anything about it? >> I'm guessing that they want to talk to me about business stuff and so this is the only business related thing that they can talk about and so that's probably why they talk about it or they bring it up um or they want to feel like in some ways it's kind of like progressive productive procrastination or that I'm going to somehow give them one answer that's going to like finally get them over the hump of starting, but most people start because one, starting feels like this very amorphous thing. When it when it I I like I was going to say like have you has there ever been something that you don't know how to do?

1:10>> [laughter] >> Well, whenever I approach something that I don't know how to do it, always feels amorphous. It's like this big thing and I don't know where to start like how do like how do I grab onto a piece of it? And so having gone and attacked like these amorphous things like start a business which actually means nothing, you have to break things down to much smaller steps of action. That's why for me the most basic thing to start a business is like get an LLC, open [clears throat] a bank account, have the ability to process money and then ask a stranger if you can do something for them in exchange for money. As soon as you do those four things, congratulations, you're a business owner.

1:43You've already beaten like 95% of people who and you've also changed your title from watchapreneur to entrepreneur. And I think that is one of the most just like when you when a customer buys from you versus just consuming your free stuff, their identity completely changes. They're now a customer, which means they're far more likely to purchase uh uh future things from me than somebody who's not bought something. That's why, you know, ascensions and renewals are much easier than getting somebody to buy the first time, right? And so, I think to the same degree for us as entrepreneurs or people who aspire to be an entrepreneur, it's like go make the first dollar. And then as soon as you have that taste of like, oh, this isn't I I actually grabbed the corner of this thing. I I I understand.

2:16I just got to get them to give me money to do something. Or I can build something and then have them buy it from me and then I have to figure out how to build more of them, right? If it's a thing. But like, that's it at the most basic level. And everything else is just is is confusion. >> If you could go back to the starting blocks and whisper something in Alex's ear when he was starting up, advice that would have made the journey easier, more profitable, whatever. What is What are the sort of layers of advice you would have given him at this at starting blocks?

2:43>> [sighs and gasps] >> So, I've actually thought about this a lot. If I went back in time and I saw an older version of myself, if he appeared in this room right now, let's say 20 years from now is looking at me, my hope is that he would say nothing. Because it would mean that it worked. Now, if I if I was going back and let's say that I I I hadn't taken the step and I hadn't been able to to make the jump, what would I say in that instance? Um is you have to decide whether you care more about your future than what other people think about your future.

3:11Someone's version of you has to die. It's either your desired version of you or someone else's desired version of you. And the thing is is you're going to be with you a lot longer than they are. I think everything at the very beginning of entrepreneurship comes down to one thing, which is fear. And justified. It's It makes sense to be afraid. Like, there's a lot of risk, there's a ton of unknown, there's so much stuff that you don't know. But the only thing I can also say is that it also puts you in the exact same position as every other person starting up in entrepreneurship. They didn't know.

3:39And the only way to know is to start. And to have faith that you will not know the way up the mountain, but as you walk up the mountain, the fog starts to clear. And the fog will always be there, but you'll will be able to see the couple steps in front of you. And so, your responsibility is to only take the steps that you can see in front of you. That is it. And then once you take those steps, the next steps will become clear. And I think that's where there's an obsession with knowing the entirety. And it's because we want certainty.

4:08We want to know that if we do all of these things, it's going to work. And you don't. You want certainty from a world that will give you none. And if you're uncomfortable with that, entrepreneurship might not be for you. >> Yeah. >> But I I even say that and I almost I almost I almost regret saying that because I was so risk-averse when I started. Like people see the content now or they see you now and you're so confident and and great on podcasts. And like but I'm sure the first podcast you did, you like look at it and you just absolutely cringe, right? I had a video that I put out that was like the first content that I made that I was like reacting to my own first content. And it's horrendous. It's horrible.

4:40But the thing is is that you have to be willing to be cringe. You must embrace cringeness. You will not be cool. It will not look good. You will suck. And everyone will know you suck. And you will know you suck. But again, it's do I care more about their version of me or my version of me? And am I willing to be a work in progress or am I unwilling to do it because I want to keep my current station in life? But the thing is is that you're at a local maximum. And there's a desire in you probably, if I'm talking to my younger self, to be at a higher maximum than I am right now. I feel like I'm capable of doing more.

5:11But I'm so afraid of risking this tiny little bit that I built for myself. But the the the reality is that the only guarantee that you have and of all the paths in front of you is that you stay on the current path, you will not get what you want. >> Mhm. >> So, there is a chance that you get what you want if you move, but there is zero chance if you stay. And I think those were some of the thought processes that actually got me to take action, was knowing that I for sure guaranteed 100% would be dissatisfied with my life if I had not taken the shot.

5:38And then playing out plan B with excruciating detail. And I think that's also one of the big ones for fear. Is that like fear only exists in the vague, never in the specific. Also, so does confusion. Right? So, the fear is I'm going to do this thing and I'm going to fail. Fail's not specific. And I'm And then everyone's going to hate me. And then eventually I'm going to get ostracized and die. Like we catastrophize everything because we're evolutionary beings, right? We're we're we're we're mammals.

6:04But if you really think, what is failure like what does failure even mean? I I I ask someone to buy and they say no, is that failure? What if I ask another person? What if I ask a hundred people? Okay, well what if I ask every single person and all hundred people say no? Am I allowed to change what I'm what I'm offering? Yes. Okay, so you get another hundred people and maybe one of them says yes. Okay, but even in that period of time where you had the hundred people who all said no to you. And let's say you quit your job and so you have no income. Okay, what are what are the options available to you? Can you talk Can you go and sleep on a friend's couch? Can you go back home with your tail between your legs? Well, it's only tail between your legs if you stop trying. If you go home and say, "Mom and Dad, I want to save up some capital so that I can I can extend my runway so that I can go after this big goal." Mom and Dad might be cool. It might be friends. It might be Or might be ten friends going together and and cuz I split a bedroom.

6:50So I had a house with six people in it. Um and I split one of the bedrooms with another guy. It'd be four hundred bucks a month. And I had a mattress on the floor. And I was never there. But it was just like I tried to keep my living expenses as low as possible. And I think one of the big ones especially is that um people are unwilling to sacrifice their short-term lifestyle and appearances in order to achieve their long-term goal. And so they're handcuffed to their lifestyle. And so [clears throat] you'd be astonished at how little you can actually live on if you try to live on little.

7:16>> This goes to back to the long-term thinking argument as well, which is like if you think about your status in ten years versus today. >> Yes. And I'm I'm willing to take this dip. >> One of the things you said was really interesting and I It's dawned on me that most people might not realize this about people like you, which is that you said there's uncertainty all the way up. Now I imagine Imagine an eighteen-year-old entrepreneur listening to Alex Hormozi. They're going to be thinking, "Oh, he's got it everything figured out all the way up. And he's no longer living with uncertainty, fear, confusion, ambiguity.

7:43He's no longer having to think hard about how to solve a problem because he's got all the answers. >> Right. >> But actually, as you described it, in my head I I imagined all of these the sequence of almost never-ending doors that all just have a cryptic message on on them. And you imagine you go through one door and there's 10 more and they all have >> [laughter] >> You know, you go through one and you're like, "Okay, this was the right one." And then there's 10 new ones that all have a vague language on them and you've got to pick which one to go through next. You go through Okay, you bounced off that one. Oh, [ __ ] You took an L.

8:11Lost some money. You go through another one. Okay, this was the right one. And then there's 20. Actually, your optionality is increasing with the more success you have. So, there's more doors and more decisions to make, more uncertainty. Which most people don't realize, but actually, as you were saying, I was thinking, "Fuck, this is exactly what I'm going through now." Like, I I was up till the early hours of the morning with one of my colleagues yesterday night and we're just figuring out which door to walk through. >> So, this is really interesting because the earlier you are in your journey, the more specific the advice is.

8:37Because if you do not have a business, the first step is the same for everyone, which is you must start an entity and then you have to have a bank account so that you can exchange money. And you have to have a a way or manner of collecting that cash. Now, of course, you could have cash business, but I would say most people use credit cards now. So, you have a processor, a bank account, and an entity. It doesn't matter what business you start. That is the first step. Now, as the business grows, you have more resources, the the nature of the business is different, and so the number of doors that are ahead of you are actually multiplied by a huge factor.

9:06And so right now, it's actually never easier to know what to do than when you start. And so it has nothing to do with you not knowing. Of course, you know, I just we just said it. It's everything to figure out why you're not doing it. And more specifically, whose voice you're listening to that is not yours that you are afraid of disappointing or afraid of their judgment. And if you can identify that voice cuz and you actually put a name on it, it's not like, "Oh, what are people going to think?" It's not people. It's probably like two people. And if you name you're like, "Oh, it's just James and Betty?

9:38So >> this is really real. So one, when I was about to sell Gym Launch, I really it was actually a very hard decision for me, super hard. Um, and when I exited, one of the reasons I almost didn't exit was because there was somebody that I knew in my circle, not even like a super close friend, that I realized when I got really clear on whose voice I cared about, I thought that they didn't think that $46 million was enough money. That they wouldn't think it was legit. >> [laughter] >> I'm dead serious. No, it was it was like that was my that was my it was my it's like he's he's not going to think he's not going to think [laughter] I'm legit.

10:09It was only when I was like, am I going to not do this and let him control me? Cuz that's what it is. They control you. And then when you say it in those terms it feels like much heavier. Like, I'm letting my mom or my uncle or my brother or the the coworker John control me. Because I that's how much I care about this guy's approval? I care I have to care about my approval more. I want to say say this in more detail cuz I think it's it's important. The person that you see in front of you is not the person who who took the leap to start the business. I belabored that decision for 6 months.

10:43I I had almost like a pre-canned answer when people were like, oh, so what are you doing in your career? I was like, oh, you know, I'm consulting, like to do business school and then someday start my own business. It was like I I could say it in my sleep. But the someday start my own business, when I tried to think a little bit more first principles, I was like, okay, well, in what way is this business school going to help me start a business? And when I looked at the starting salaries of business school, it was like $120,000 a year after you went to a good business school. And then I thought to myself, well, it'll cost me $60,000 a year and I can't make money during that period. So I'm going to lose 120 for sure, and at the time I was making 50-60,000 a year.

11:12And so I was like, so it's $240,000 is my call it my opportunity cost of the in 2 years. Do I think that I can take the money that I had saved up and in 2 years get to $10,000 a month? I was like, I think I can do it. And so that was part of the reason that I ended up not going to business school, and it was because of a question on the business school test. Was, how will a Booth MBA help in short and long term goals? And I sat there for 3 days trying to answer it and I realized I was like, I don't know if it will help my long-term >> interesting. >> So, I mean it's good that they have these questions cuz it actually forced me to answer it. Now, back to the the the 6 months. I read I I was probably reading no joke a book every 2 days cuz I the job that I had had high seasons and low seasons and during low season I basically just read books. And they were almost all self-help books.

11:54And I got to this point after reading however many of them that I looked back at my life and realized it was exactly the same and I thought oh, if I don't do anything, my life's not going to change. And so I had this idea that if I just keep reading these books, somehow my life was just going to change. And that was like one of the realizations that I had. I had a friend who was also in a white-collar, you know, job like I was every night we'd probably get on the phone for 2 to 3 hours and talk about how we were going to start a business.

12:20And I had this I had this this IKEA carpet that I bought that was a a cowhide carpet and the spot where I'd walk back and forth was like worn out on the cowhide because of how much I would just pace in my small flat just going back and forth just talking about the ideas that I had to start a business. Every time I wanted to start it, I would tell my dad I want to start the business and he he would be like, let's let's not be unreasonable here. He's like, you've got a good job. He's like, you're following the plan. You did Vanderbilt in 3 years, you had good grades, you got you were going to do 2 years here, then you go to one of the top Ivy, you know, MBA schools. Like, it's you're good. Don't like this is part of it. This is part of it, right? I acted with such cowardice that I had to I had to drive halfway across the country before I could call my dad to tell him that I that I had quit my job and that I was going to start a business.

13:09Because I knew that if I had done it while he was there, he would talk me out of it. Because he had already talked me out of it a bunch of times. >> Why was he doing that? I I learned a little bit about his background over the last couple of days. We've got some photos of him. >> Uh >> That's right. The OG. >> And I think there's context in his own story which >> Yeah. >> completes the picture. >> So, whatever people see of my success, I think in a lot of ways what my dad accomplished, the more I think about it, is bigger.

13:34My dad fled during the Iranian revolution, right? And then he went to go to France to become a doctor. But he didn't speak French. And so he had to go try to go into medical school and take Orgo in a language that he didn't understand. And so he failed two years in a row. His brother was like, "Go to Belgium, start fresh, go to new place." And so he ended up getting all the way through medical school and then he met my mother in medical school and then they came back to the US. Now, his medical degree didn't transfer to the US. And so he had to get a US fellowship in order or residency or whatever, but no one would take a Middle Eastern guy who had a super thick accent who was fresh out of medical school and there was all these US based people here. And so for two years he ran x-ray slides. He finally gets a residency and then he decides when he comes back to Baltimore, which is where my where where I'm from, that he's going to instead of join the practice that my mother had with her father, he was going to go out on his own.

14:28Which is pretty ballsy, right? He didn't have he foreigner, didn't have anything. And so he asked to find out how much a construction cost for building your own surgery center and it was like $250,000 then, so it was a lot of money. He didn't have that. And so he looked at all the legal requirements for what what it entails to be a surgery center and then he went to Home Depot and built a surgery center that met all the specs and got it inspected so that he could have his own surgery center in his practice. Then, right as his practice is starting to work, my parents got divorced. They changed the the locks on the door cuz he had like a separate thing. His patients show up and they didn't know where to go. It was an ugly divorce. And so then he's he's starting his own. And this is when he was talking to me then. So fast forward now. He's like, "I've been in practice for, you know, 20, 30 years or whatever." He's like, "Those years, I didn't even think about them. I think I was like, I feel like I'm not moving fast enough. I feel like I need to need to do these things." And he's like, "Dude, a year or two years now, he's like, it's nothing. He's like, when you're my age you're not even going to think you're not even going to remember it.

15:25>> Mhm. >> The The honest truth of the matter is that I really desperately wanted to prove that I could do it on my own. >> Who did you want to prove that to? >> I don't know. Everyone. Me, him, the world. I remember being terrified about the idea of winning the lottery. Sounds really weird. >> [laughter] >> When I was in college, I bought a Super Bowl ticket cuz it was like a billion dollars or so. I was like, let's do it for fun, whatever. And I And I remember having this this moment right before the the number was going to get called of sheer terror of what if I win?

15:54Because I was like, I will never be able to prove that I I have the metal, that I can do it. And so, and of course people would say Now, if someone was to give me a billion dollars, I'm happy to use it cuz to be fair though, because I already have this I already have the status and the track record that I that I built this. >> Mhm. >> And this also the reason that like when I started my my business, like I didn't take a loan. Like I used my own money that I had saved because I I wanted to be mine. And I knew I wouldn't know.

16:20And I think yeah, my dad had absolutely perfect intentions. He gave me what I believe to be for vast majority people probably pretty good advice. >> Mhm. >> It just wasn't the advice that I needed for the goals that I had.